Tatoos

I've been at this for decades, and I still learn new stuff regularly.

Here's a Bible verse that I have never taken note of before..

28 “Don’t gash your bodies on behalf of the dead.
“Don’t tattoo yourselves. I am God.

SO once again, the question of continuity is raised. What commandments, out of the Old Testament are Christians obligated to, and which ones aren't?

The preceding verse i n this context says: “Don’t cut the hair on the sides of your head or trim your beard.

AND the following verse says:
“Don’t violate your daughter by making her a [censored]—the whole country would soon become a brothel, filled with sordid sex.

Passages quoted from Eugene H. Peterson, The Message : The Bible in Contemporary Language

[dancingqueen]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Aydeloof</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SO once again, the question of continuity is raised. What commandments, out of the Old Testament are Christians obligated to, and which ones aren't?</div></div>

usually the ones tht suit thei needs.
I have met many Christians, however, that recognize all sins as equal including their own and those people tend to be respected by people of all walks of life

DQ, this question relates to how the Christian should interpret the Bible.

Do you believe the Christian should not trim his hair on the sides? Should we grow locks down the sides of our heads like you see on orthodox Jews?

SO the real question is: What principles SHOULD guide us in our interpretation of Scripture? Not what principles are being applied that obviously are being used for convenience sake.

[Return of Too Many Daves]

Aydeloof are any of those qualified in the New Testament.

Incidentally, I've always maintained there is some really wise stuff in the bible, and I completely agree about tatoos.

[Karen-Annie]

I'd certainly have to do some reading but don't I somewhere recall there being,in the New Testament, passages that speak to this? Where Jesus pretty much says which 'laws" from the Old Testament are "legit" (i.e. from God) and which ones are 'man-made" ? Many of the laws were more predicated on the living conditions of the time...eg.the kosher dietary rules....and seem to be less about "sin" and more about not getting sick/dying.

[Boondock]

I have several tattoos so I guess I'm going to hell... What a great god.

[Soundbear]

Your god is obviously pretty small. Mine is way bigger than that.

[Boondock]

Might be a little too hungover from last nights concert but I'm not comprehending what the hell you just said.

[Return of Too Many Daves]

His is bigger than yours.

[Boondock]

I get to use mine I win. ...lol wtf are we talking about. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

GUys, this conversation is already tanking.

Note, the p[ost is not making a statement.
It is asking a question.

The question is not (at this point) are all tatoo wearers in violation of God's will.

If you do not believe in the Bible or beleive in God, you do not have to jump all over this with your disbelief or reactions. Chill out. relax..

The question is, how does a person (who cares) determine what carries over into CHristian obligations, and what doesn't?


Obviously, most CHristans don't ahve a conscience about eating pork. Why not? It is forbidden in the Old Testament.

Partly, the answer is that the Old Testament (which actually means Covenant) was made with Moses and his followers, the nation of Israel.

After the death of Christ, the Old Covenant (which we can best describe as a contractual arrangement) came to an end, and we live by a New Covenant.
Some call it a new dispensation; a new instrument of agreement, so to speak.

Yet, there is still wisdom in the Old Testament. There were physical and health reasons for many of the statutes and laws that were given.

I am just wondering out loud about the historical and cultural context of tatoos in this particular text.

Let's forgo the discussion of the rightness or wrongness of tatoos for now.

[Return of Too Many Daves]

But does the New Testament qualify any of those statements, or does it state that we should be ignoring the old testament?

[KDawg]

No. Jesus quoted the Old Testament extensively.

Yeah, he quoted the Old Testament extensively.. that's right.

But note that he was living under the law, and kept it perfectly, and having satisfied the requirements of the law. Thus he began (and announced) a new dispensation.

Dave, yes, many Old Testament items were qualified by the New Testament.

One of my questions though, is why tattoos were forbidden in that era. When I have time, I will do some digging in the books.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Aydeloof</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

Here's a Bible verse that I have never taken note of before..

28 “Don’t gash your bodies on behalf of the dead.
“Don’t tattoo yourselves. I am God.



Passages quoted from Eugene H. Peterson, The Message : The Bible in Contemporary Language </div></div>


Where exactly is this verse? Neither bible program I have can find tattoo.

[Soundbear]

Found it.

I think you would be streching to say that the word used means specifically and only tattoo.

Also, this article is good:

http://www.sacredink.net/tattoo_and_the_bible/

Tattoo And The Bible
Christians with tattoos, Christian tattoos and Christian tattooists, what does the Bible teach about the current style of body décor? If the Scriptures tell us that tattooing is a behavior that God says is wrong in any way, then it's certainly off limits for God's followers. But does the Bible teach that God forbids tattoos and other cosmetic body modifications?

The main scripture that concerns many people with regards to tattooing is this verse from the remarkable Old Testament book of Leviticus

“You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves: I am the LORD.”
Leviticus 19:28 — New American Standard

At first glance this passage seems to indicate that tattoo is forbidden for Christians. To comprehend the Scripture correctly, we must always examine the whole of Scripture and look at the particular context of a given passage. If we neglect deep study we will never truly understand the intent of the author. We need to look at the word(s) of the above passage in full connection with the surrounding verses, and in context with the historic setting at the time of its writing. When we study below the surface of this text, we then will see more clearly what God says about tattoo. The verse quoted above is part of a larger passage of scripture seen here.

26 ‘You shall not eat anything with the blood, nor practice divination or soothsaying. 27 You shall not round off the side-growth of your heads nor harm the edges of your beard. 28 ‘You shall not make any cuts in your body for the dead nor make any tattoo marks on yourselves: I am the LORD. 29 ‘Do not profane your daughter by making her a harlot, so that the land will not fall to harlotry and the land become full of lewdness. 30 ‘You shall keep My sabbaths and revere My sanctuary; I am the LORD. 31 ‘Do not turn to mediums or spiritists; do not seek them out to be defiled by them. I am the LORD your God.
Leviticus 19:26–31 — New American Standard

In this passage God is speaking to his covenant people Israel. He is specifically telling them to stay far from the religious practices of the surrounding people groups. The prohibited religious practices in these verses include eating bloody meat, fortune telling, certain hair cuts related to the priests of false cults, cutting or marking the body for dead relatives, cultic prostitution and consulting psychics. All these practices would lead God's beloved people away from Him and toward false gods that were not Gods at all. In the midst of this context we find the word translated “tattoo marks” in verse 28. It is important to note here that the context of this passage is not one of body décor but one of marking one's self in connection with cultic religious worship. Bible commentaries tell us much about the eastern religious practices that God was warning His people to shun.

These prohibitions seem to relate to pagan religious customs which should be avoided, including pagan mourning rites (vv. 27-28)
Walvoord, J. F., Zuck, R. B., & Dallas Theological Seminary. (1983–c1985). The Bible knowledge commentary: An exposition of the scriptures. Wheaton, IL: Victor Books.

The practice of making deep gashes on the face and arms and legs, in time of bereavement, was universal among the heathen, and it was deemed a becoming mark of respect for the dead, as well as a sort of propitiatory offering to the deities who presided over death and the grave. The Jews learned this custom in Egypt, and though weaned from it, relapsed in a later and degenerate age into this old superstition (Is 15:2; Je 16:6; 41:5). “nor print any marks upon you” (v:28 )—by tattooing, imprinting figures of flowers, leaves, stars, and other fanciful devices on various parts of their person. The impression was made sometimes by means of a hot iron, sometimes by ink or paint, as is done by the Arab females of the present day and the different castes of the Hindus. It it probable that a strong propensity to adopt such marks in honor of some idol gave occasion to the prohibition in this verse; and they were wisely forbidden.
Jamieson, R., Fausset, A. R., Fausset, A. R., Brown, D., & Brown, D. (1997). A commentary, critical and explanatory, on the Old and New Testaments. On spine: Critical and explanatory commentary. (Le 19:28). Oak Harbor, WA: Logos Research Systems, Inc.

“Make any cuttings in your flesh” (v:28): the reference here is to the practice of making deep gashes in the skin while mourning the death of a relative. This was done to provide life blood for the spirit of the dead person rather than to express sorrow. On account of the dead: as indicated above, this describes the purpose of all the actions in verse 27 as well as verse 28.
Péter-Contesse, R., & Ellington. (1992). A handbook on Leviticus. UBS handbooks; Helps for translating (Page 296). New York: United Bible Societies.

The “tattoo” marks described in Leviticus 19:28 were clearly related to false religious practices. The word translated tattoo in our English Bibles is the Hebrew word “qa aqa”, this word appears only one time in the Bible, here in this passage Leviticus. The word “qa aqa” means literally “to cut” but taken with the surrounding words indicates a cutting that left a mark imprinted in the skin. This could have been a form of branding, scarring, cutting or a process where ink was inlaid into the skin; there is not enough data to fully define exactly what this word meant. However we translate the word “qa aqa” though, in this passage, it is certainly used in the context of cultic religious worship. The prohibition against “qa aqa”, (translated tattoo) was to keep the Israelites from being involved or affiliated with cultic worship practices.

The tattoo of today is much different than it was for those who originally received the Pentateuch. Today tattoo is a decorative means of self expression and personal decoration. In our current culture people modify their appearance for beauty in many ways such as clothing choice, makeup, plastic surgery, haircutting and coloring, weight loss, body-building, and ear piercing. Some of these practices have a history in ancient ritual and false religion, but in our cultural context they do not denote a connection with evil or false faith. In the same way tattoos today do not link the wearer to cultic worship practices and is not generally practiced for ancient religious purposes, tattoos today are for ornamentation.

A further reason to believe Christians are free to tattoo their bodies is that New Testament believers are not bound by the Old Testament laws to gain or regain right relationship with God. If we were to obey the laws of the Old Testament we would also be bound by rules that would restrict shellfish and pork eating, hairstyles, wearing of clothes made from two different fabrics, even eating cheese on hamburgers (yes, it is true). Some also feel that modifying the body somehow defiles God's creation, but if this was true would it be right to pierce ears, correct a club foot, cut hair, clip nails, get a tan or use orthodontia? Each of the previously mentioned practices modifies the way we were originally created, some permanently. Getting a tattoo is a deeply personal choice that falls in the category of personal appearance and is vitally connected to the freedom of the believer. The Apostle Paul reminds us that the Old Testament Law was designed by God was to lead people toward Jesus. Now that Jesus has come and set us free, we are not under the law for our good standing with God. Our right standing before God comes from placing our trust in Jesus’ death on the cross to pay for our debts, not on following the Old Testament regulations.

24 Therefore the Law has become our tutor to lead us to Christ, so that we may be justified by faith. 25 But now that faith has come, we are no longer under a tutor.
Galatians 3:24–25 — New American Standard

As New Testament followers of Jesus we are not under restriction in the area of personal décor.

Tattoo of today can describe images that merely please the wearer, or have deeper meaning to the owner. Many Christians today are tattooing themselves not in tribute to a false idol or anti-Christian deity, but with love for the one true God and Creator. Many today utilize this permanent marking a way of giving glory to God. Some find that Christian tattoos attract questions about faith and provide opportunities to give God glory by allowing the story-telling of His Love to those who aren’t convinced yet. See, hear, and experience the testimonies of Tattooed followers of Jesus.

A parting thought about tattoo and younger people
Tattoo is a significant life-choice and should be only entered into with a great deal of forethought. Some questions to ask yourself if you are young and considering a tattoo are:

Am I legally of an age to get a tattoo?
If I live with my parents, would my parents support my decision?
Would I be defying the authority God gave my parents over me at my current age?
Would I still want this particular image when I get older?
What if my future mate wouldn't like having to see this image for a lifetime?
Would this tattoo be in an area of my body that would be plainly visible? – Many people do unfairly judge people with tattoos as being “second-class.”
Would this image bring God glory?
Do I feel fully convinced that tattoos are allowable for Christians?
For a more in depth review of tattoo and the Bible, check out (Im)Morality of Tattoos.

Tattoo is not for everyone, and is certainly not for a Christian who feels unconvinced that getting a tattoo is completely Biblical. In this and many areas of the Christian life there are many truly excellent believers who have varying degrees of agreement and disagreement about Christians with tattoos. In whatever you believe about this issue I hope that you will leave gracious space for others who might feel differently. May ALL things bring Glory to our great God and Sovereign Lord, Jesus the Christ.

Pastor Chuckk Gerwig
Pastor to Students and their Families
Santa Cruz Bible Church
Santa Cruz, California

Thanks for that, Barry. I haven't had the time yet to chase that down. If I do, I'd want to confirm that it was in connection with cultic pagan religions.. when commentators use words like "it seems" it tells me they don't know.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Boondock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have several tattoos so I guess I'm going to hell... What a great god. </div></div>

Just to clarify, not that I think you'll read this.

God is not interested in the outward appearance, but in the heart. Even if a tattoo was wrong, He could still forgive.
Please note that King David, a "man after God's own heart" was a murderer, and yet found forgiveness. That's why I say your god is small, because my God can and will forgive anything except rejecting Him.

[Soundbear]

The concern Christians have with things like tattoos is the inverse of the mistaken belief that works can get us into heaven.

No physical good OR bad thing can ultimately either help or hinder our eternal salvation. There is only ONE unforgivable sin and that is rejection of God. Conversely, there is only one door to salvation, submission to Him.

Barry, you are claiming (in your inverse kind of statement) that Christians are concerned that a tattoo will keep a person out of heaven.

I am not aware that this is why Christians have a problem with tattoos.

I think rather the concern lies buried in our history dating back to a period of time when tattos had more than just an aesthetic (cosmetic) purpose.

[Boondock]

So your basically saying I can break all of his rules my entire life but as long as we're tight before I die i'm good to go.

That was for Barry btw

[Return of Too Many Daves]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Boondock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I have several tattoos so I guess I'm going to hell... What a great god. </div></div>

Just to clarify, not that I think you'll read this.

God is not interested in the outward appearance, but in the heart. Even if a tattoo was wrong, He could still forgive.
Please note that King David, a "man after God's own heart" was a murderer, and yet found forgiveness. That's why I say your god is small, because my God can and will forgive anything except rejecting Him. </div></div>

Well I'm confused. Just how many Gods are there?

[Barney Rubble]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The concern Christians have with things like tattoos is the inverse of the mistaken belief that works can get us into heaven.

No physical good OR bad thing can ultimately either help or hinder our eternal salvation. There is only ONE unforgivable sin and that is rejection of God. Conversely, there is only one door to salvation, submission to Him. </div></div>

i disagree!!
There is only ONE unforgiveable sin & that is:

Matthew 12:31-32
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

also, submission to GOD is not the door to salvation.
Were not the jewish priests submissive to GOD & thinking tha they are doing his will.
The only way to salvation is:

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

To say that there is another way is kinda dangerous as I believe it is calling JESUS a liar!

r u serious?

[Barney Rubble]

Jas 2:10

For whosoever shall keep the whole law, and yet offend in one point, he is guilty of all.


Therefore, what is the difference between drunkenness, homosexuality, tattoos, gossiping, murder etc etc etc??

There is no greater sin (except the one against The HOLY SPIRIT).
Sin is sin...there is no difference...all is separation with GOD!

Yes, i suppose tattoos are wrong but we all have the availability of redemption no matter the sins

A - Accept
B - Believe
C - Confess

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Aydeloof</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Barry, you are claiming (in your inverse kind of statement) that Christians are concerned that a tattoo will keep a person out of heaven.

I am not aware that this is why Christians have a problem with tattoos.

I think rather the concern lies buried in our history dating back to a period of time when tattos had more than just an aesthetic (cosmetic) purpose.

</div></div>

Yeah, I guess.

I just wish Christians would recognize that every crooked politician, dishonest lawyer and high-end drug dealer wears a suit, and therefore stop insisting (unspoken rule) that we need to wear suits to church!! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Boondock</div><div class="ubbcode-body">So your basically saying I can break all of his rules my entire life but as long as we're tight before I die i'm good to go.

That was for Barry btw </div></div>

Do you love anyone?? Why would you think you could disdain everything they stood for, and hope to get forgiveness later??

God loves you, and if you love God, you wouldn't consider living like that.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The concern Christians have with things like tattoos is the inverse of the mistaken belief that works can get us into heaven.

No physical good OR bad thing can ultimately either help or hinder our eternal salvation. There is only ONE unforgivable sin and that is rejection of God. Conversely, there is only one door to salvation, submission to Him. </div></div>

i disagree!!
There is only ONE unforgiveable sin & that is:

Matthew 12:31-32
Wherefore I say unto you, All manner of sin and blasphemy shall be forgiven unto men: but the blasphemy against the Holy Ghost shall not be forgiven unto men. And whosoever speaketh a word against the Son of man, it shall be forgiven him: but whosoever speaketh against the Holy Spirit, it shall not be forgiven him, neither in this world, neither in the world to come.

also, submission to GOD is not the door to salvation.
Were not the jewish priests submissive to GOD & thinking tha they are doing his will.
The only way to salvation is:

Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me.

To say that there is another way is kinda dangerous as I believe it is calling JESUS a liar! </div></div>

There were many in the OT that never heard of Jesus, and yet were saved. Jesus made it possible, but many never heard Hs name.

It's not another way, it's the SAME way!!!

Barney, you and I posted at the same time and I was responding to Too many Daves, with my R U Serious question. I should have quoted his post to avoid confusion.

same way, different words.. but Barry I have had this discussion with you before.

Submission to God as the way of salvation sounds like works of obedience.. and without any further explanation, it does sound like a different way. It causes confusion.

There's a verse in Romans 1:5
"Through him and for his name’s sake, we received grace and apostleship to call people from among all the Gentiles to the obedience that comes from faith."

Obedience comes FROM faith.
Faith does not come from submission or obedience.
It is a lifestyle of obedience and submission that had it's beginnings in that moment when genuine faith in Christ occurred. And I believe that moment is a miraculous one. That's why we call it being born again. It's a very exciting thing that happens. It's powerful. It changes everything.

[Barney Rubble]

i forget the verse Barry but, & i think Paul said, that CHRIST first descended & preached to those in chains (old testament people) before he ascended.
i do believe that some old testament people might have been in a "state of grace" but there is no way anybody was "saved" without CHRIST.
Everybody has the chance to at least hear the word!!
AND......Who is The Word??

People can be pious, religious & doing all those things to please GOD but if you dont accept CHRIST as Saviour, what does it edify???
Squat!!!

Somehow, hearing the gospel and reading your signature that offers to rock the beds of others in the same post doesn't harmonize..I sense some dissonance going on here..

[Barney Rubble]

never realized signature
don't usually post in religion.
too many arguments,big words and / or theories whereas the simplicity in CHRIST seems to get lost along the way!

signture was a pun...bedrock...the town
removed signature due to offence
/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[Barney Rubble]

לזכור

translation from hebrew to english is "remember"


i am considering getting this hebrew put on my right forearm.
along with "2 Cor.8:21"
remember to go whaT'S RIGHT, to do good, to live christian values!

[bluekrissyspikes]

did you guys come to a conclusion on if tattoos are bad or not? i used to attend a christian church and i started dating a man i met there, but when he saw my tats he freaked out and started quoting me scriptures. he also said my dragon tat is a representation of the devil...which it's not, its a cute fairy dragon with butterfly wings and flowers...how very evil. i have been trying to fallow this thread, but i'm lost now...so back to the original question, bad or not? being seem as less christian because of my tattoos is, along with being told that my gramma was going to hell for loving a woman, what made me give up my pursuit of christianity, and i'd like to know if it was only the church i joined that sees things like that. incase anyone is wondering the church is called the church of christ.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">never realized signature
don't usually post in religion.
too many arguments,big words and / or theories whereas the simplicity in CHRIST seems to get lost along the way!

signture was a pun...bedrock...the town
removed signature due to offence
/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

Oh no, Barney.. I wasn't offended.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Benny Hinn will take your $$$$ tatoos or none
Jimmy Swaggert doesn't care one way or tother

Give me your $$$$$ and you shall be saved </div></div>

Yeah, yeah, we all know that there are sinners in the world.

God commanded us to give back a portion of what He gave us. So what's the big deal??

I'll remind you that some of that money given feeds people right here in SSM. Who do you think funds places like the Salvation Army, or St. Vincent?? It sure ain't taxes.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluekrissyspikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">did you guys come to a conclusion on if tattoos are bad or not? i used to attend a christian church and i started dating a man i met there, but when he saw my tats he freaked out and started quoting me scriptures. he also said my dragon tat is a representation of the devil...which it's not, its a cute fairy dragon with butterfly wings and flowers...how very evil. i have been trying to fallow this thread, but i'm lost now...so back to the original question, bad or not? being seem as less christian because of my tattoos is, along with being told that my gramma was going to hell for loving a woman, what made me give up my pursuit of christianity, and i'd like to know if it was only the church i joined that sees things like that. incase anyone is wondering the church is called the church of christ. </div></div>

No, tattoos are not sinful.

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i forget the verse Barry but, & i think Paul said, that CHRIST first descended & preached to those in chains (old testament people) before he ascended.
i do believe that some old testament people might have been in a "state of grace" but there is no way anybody was "saved" without CHRIST.
Everybody has the chance to at least hear the word!!
AND......Who is The Word??

People can be pious, religious & doing all those things to please GOD but if you dont accept CHRIST as Saviour, what does it edify???
Squat!!! </div></div>

I'll be checking into those verses.

Seems to me that you set up some interesting contradictions with what you believe.

[bluekrissyspikes]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluekrissyspikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">did you guys come to a conclusion on if tattoos are bad or not? i used to attend a christian church and i started dating a man i met there, but when he saw my tats he freaked out and started quoting me scriptures. he also said my dragon tat is a representation of the devil...which it's not, its a cute fairy dragon with butterfly wings and flowers...how very evil. i have been trying to fallow this thread, but i'm lost now...so back to the original question, bad or not? being seem as less christian because of my tattoos is, along with being told that my gramma was going to hell for loving a woman, what made me give up my pursuit of christianity, and i'd like to know if it was only the church i joined that sees things like that. incase anyone is wondering the church is called the church of christ. </div></div>

No, tattoos are not sinful. </div></div>

thanks barry

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SHAME SHAME using a PC on Sunday,you're going to burn in hell
---------------------------------------------------------
and just how much does the church give to the Sally Ann
Bet you can never get that figure,but then Benny Hinn won't give out that info and Swaggart he keeps all the $$$$$$$$
And the Suckers just keep giving </div></div>

Why's that KWB, Sunday ain't the Sabbath!!

How much does MY church give to various charities?? Funny you should mention. I just picked up a copy of the annual report this morning, and it lists all the money that came in, and where it went.

Now, I can't speak for all evangelists like Hinn and Swaggart. It's not you or me they will have to answer to. And they will answer, have no fear.

You remind me of a something I heard. The same reporters that went after Jimmy Bakker, and brought him down, decided to go after the Billy Graham organization. Graham's people just opened the books to them. End of story.

I leave you with a tidbit:

Mark 12:41 Now Jesus sat opposite the treasury and saw how the people put money into the treasury. And many who were rich put in much.
42 Then one poor widow came and threw in two mites, which make a quadrans.
43 So He called His disciples to Himself and said to them, "Assuredly, I say to you that this poor widow has put in more than all those who have given to the treasury;
44 "for they all put in out of their abundance, but she out of her poverty put in all that she had, her whole livelihood."

Shame, KWB??? I won't have to account for you, and you won't have to account for me.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluekrissyspikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">did you guys come to a conclusion on if tattoos are bad or not? i used to attend a christian church and i started dating a man i met there, but when he saw my tats he freaked out and started quoting me scriptures. he also said my dragon tat is a representation of the devil...which it's not, its a cute fairy dragon with butterfly wings and flowers...how very evil. i have been trying to fallow this thread, but i'm lost now...so back to the original question, bad or not? being seem as less christian because of my tattoos is, along with being told that my gramma was going to hell for loving a woman, what made me give up my pursuit of christianity, and i'd like to know if it was only the church i joined that sees things like that. incase anyone is wondering the church is called the church of christ. </div></div>

No, tattoos are not sinful. </div></div>

Quit feeding trolls Barry. It only encourages him.

[Soundbear]

It seems like an honest question, especially considering the answer above.

Or maybe you meant KWB???

I mean KWB..

[Barney Rubble]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i forget the verse Barry but, & i think Paul said, that CHRIST first descended & preached to those in chains (old testament people) before he ascended.
i do believe that some old testament people might have been in a "state of grace" but there is no way anybody was "saved" without CHRIST.
Everybody has the chance to at least hear the word!!
AND......Who is The Word??

People can be pious, religious & doing all those things to please GOD but if you dont accept CHRIST as Saviour, what does it edify???
Squat!!! </div></div>

I'll be checking into those verses.

Seems to me that you set up some interesting contradictions with what you believe. </div></div>




Remember hell (hades) and paradise were side by side in the abode of the earth. One could look from one into the other. A great gulf separated the two so that never the two could meet (Luke 16:19-31).

We are told by Peter of some very unusual happenings concerning those three days. "For Christ also hath once suffered for sins, the just for the unjust, that he might bring us to God, being put to death in the flesh, but quickened by the Spirit: By which also HE WENT AND PREACHED UNTO THE SPIRITS IN PRISON;" (I Peter 3:18-19).

"For, for this cause was THE GOSPEL PREACHED ALSO TO THEM THAT ARE DEAD, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit" (I Peter 4:6).

These scriptures are not telling us that these people were given another chance. It is telling us that Jesus proclaimed that He was the Messiah, the promise of God had been fulfilled, and that he had power over death, hell, and was victorious.

There's also Matthew 12:40

for as Jonah was three days and three nights in the belly of the whale; so shall the Son of man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth.


No contradictions & as far as John 14:6, it's in black & white plain & simple.

[Soundbear]

Simple?? I suggest you search google with this:

+"bible" +"spirits in prison"

You'll find some interesting ideas as to exactly who those spirits were. Check the entire context as to WHEN the preaching took place. Interesting.

Re:

No contradictions & as far as John 14:6, it's in black & white plain & simple.

Oddly enough, I don't think there's any contradiction there either. I just think maybe we read too much into verses sometimes.

[bluekrissyspikes]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Aydeloof</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluekrissyspikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">did you guys come to a conclusion on if tattoos are bad or not? i used to attend a christian church and i started dating a man i met there, but when he saw my tats he freaked out and started quoting me scriptures. he also said my dragon tat is a representation of the devil...which it's not, its a cute fairy dragon with butterfly wings and flowers...how very evil. i have been trying to fallow this thread, but i'm lost now...so back to the original question, bad or not? being seem as less christian because of my tattoos is, along with being told that my gramma was going to hell for loving a woman, what made me give up my pursuit of christianity, and i'd like to know if it was only the church i joined that sees things like that. incase anyone is wondering the church is called the church of christ. </div></div>

No, tattoos are not sinful. </div></div>

Quit feeding trolls Barry. It only encourages him. </div></div>

that wasn't very nice. i may be having a bad hair day, but i'm not a troll. is there something wrong with me having a question? i'm starting to get more interested in religion again and trying to put more consideration into my beleifs. i'm trying to figure out where i fit in, and if my tattoos would somehow limit me in my possible future choices. i was asking because i have a lot of tattoos that i can't always hide and wouldn't want to feel i had to.

[Barney Rubble]

well, i am a CHRISTIAN.
I STRUGGLE in everyday life with what is wrong and what is right.
the point to being a Christian is to try to live that life.
tattoos are meaningless in the scheme of Christianity.

[Soundbear]

Whoa, bluekrissyspikes, I think you missed a post or two. We are all agreeing that tattoos are not a problem in Christianity.

Read the whole thread. I was not referring to you, Krissyspikes'

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">well, i am a CHRISTIAN.
I STRUGGLE in everyday life with what is wrong and what is right.
the point to being a Christian is to try to live that life.
tattoos are meaningless in the scheme of Christianity.



</div></div>

I think we all agree.. but the original question was, on what basis do we decide whether something in the OT is binding today or not.

[Barney Rubble]

Ok...my opinion...& I'm not gonna look up the verses but i do believe that in Romans, Paul stated that we are FREE from the law.
Christians that is.

Are we bound...no!
Most of the laws are good common sense but we have been freed!

Nevertheless, it doesn't give us the right to go around sinning, simply because a true Christian no longer has the desire to sin.

Sure, we mess up, but we are covered by his blood of redemption.
Here's where faith comes in. Faith that His was the ultimate sacrifice for our past & ongoing straying!

[bluekrissyspikes]

sorry. didn't mean to get testy. i'm just having a bit of a rough time lately and having trouble focusing(and understanding) i'm not trying to rock the boat

I think rocking boats are more exciting than calm ones.

But when you boat is rocked over something i didn't intend.. well, then you rock for naught..

[frenchy1]

there isnt one place i know in the bible that says its wrong to have tatoos or that it will stop you from entering heaven..i personally would not get one ..just to try to take it off after you went through with it is very painful..

[frenchy1]

not all ministers in god who robs the church ...paul said that thoses you live for the bible should be paid for there time...they are accountable for what they do with this money giving freely by the congregation..they have to submit there earnings even though its a non profit organization..i imagine they pay some taxes