The Mega Church

[Soundbear]

Who has personal experience in one.

What did you experience?

[Batman]

A few years ago my family and I vacationed in Orange County California. Our hotel was only a ten minute drive from Robert Schuller's Crystal Cathedral so of course we had to do the tourist thing and check it out.

Setting aside the whole controversial 'possibility thinking' theology of Schuller, the building and grounds were amazing. While I got lost in all the life sized bronzed statues of Bible characters surrounding the main building (seen on TV but there are several other buildings on the grounds) and reading the plaques on them, my wife was overwhelmed by the contrast of all this overflowing wealth on these grounds being surrounded by poverty stricken neighborhoods of townhomes and trailer parks (not seen on tv).

There was a huge screen TV in the sanctuary that ran ads for all the mid-week services and clubs and outreaches going on throughout the weekdays and months ahead that was left running for at least an hour before the service started which is when we got there.

It seemed to be a 'historic' service we just happened to attend that day as Robert Schuller's grandson, Robert Schuller III, had been given his first opportunity to preach a sermon there as a Seminary student. It was huge and in some ways seemed even larger than you see on TV. The music was the same and the preaching was the same.

It was an experience to be sure (for better or worse). I did videotape the grounds and inside the sanctuary before the service started but did not record the service although I did see other tourists recording the service.

We were welcomed nicely by ushers and had our choice of seats (nice padded theater seats!) and did enjoy the service. We were going to visit Saddleback but it was further away and we couldn't fit it into our schedule.

I guess Peoples Church here in Toronto is probably the closest thing we'd have here in Canada to a real US mega church. Peoples is always good. I've been a number of times.

[GenX]

What part of the Sermon on the Mount talks about the need for theater-type seats and huge projection TV's again?

[Batman]

That's the part that was unsettling for my wife.

The arguement goes two ways really: 1.) Giving God your best by pouring a ton of money into a Cathedral be it made out of clear glass (Crystal Cathedral) or stained glass (St. Paul's Cathedral) - this extravagance being justified by the girl who poured a whole bottle of expensive perfume on Jesus and being blessed for it by Jesus even though she was rebuked by onlookers and

2.) How can our sense of charity be justified by all this extravagance when we are surrounded by the poor and needy? Didn't Jesus say the poor would always be with us?

It is sometimes difficult to understand why God would give such detailed instructions for the building of temple full of gold and expensive tapestries, etc.. and at the same time expect less of our contemporaries.

This is why watchdog type ministries are always needed and chains of accountability set in place so we can separate the true charitable ministers of God from the Benny Hinns of the world.

I am skeptical about the Crystal Cathedral ministries still but not as much as before I was there. On television they ask for partners and financial gifts to keep the show on the air but in person there at the church we saw the local and global missions that were funded by that church that you don't see on TV. Also, I am sure all of the beautiful statues and fountains, etc, surrounding the grounds cost untold thousands of dollars, every one had a plaque with the name of the person(s) who paid for that particular piece. It could be said that this was done to glorify the giver but it could also be said that it was to prove that television donors money was not used to decorate the church.

We all experienced mixed feelings there and I suspect we would feel the same if we ever visited Vatican City (which I really hope we can do some day! :-)

[Soundbear]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">What part of the Sermon on the Mount talks about the need for theater-type seats and huge projection TV's again? </div></div>

It's just below the plans for St' Peter's Square. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

To me, a "mega church" is somewhere where I will never really get to know everyone who attends. And that would include my 100 member church.

[GenX]

Vatican City is a political entity.

Those thousands upon thousands of opulent houses owned by countless Protestant evangelists are a totally different situation than Vatican City.

The ruins of many a poor soul who was bilked out of their life savings lie in the trail of deceit and destruction blazed by Protestant televangelists.

[Batman]

There are only a few dozen mega rich televangelists that I know of and they hardly represent the majority of protestant pastors. It's really difficult and sad when people judge the whole church, Catholicism icluded, based on these guys.

Don't kid yourself. The secular society judges the Catholic church too based on these few bad apples. It's just too bad that the few bad apples are the ones with the money to go on TV.

Vatican City may be a 'political entity' as you call it and have it's own government, etc. but it is still Church owned and funded. No one in their right mind would say Vatican City is political and not Catholic. I'm not bashing the Catholic Church for this, I'm just saying that both Catholics and Protestants are guilty of excesses. If others want to argue who is worse, let them. That is not my arguement.

[GenX]

The fact remains Vatican City is political and religious in nature. I never said it wasn't.

If someone, such as Barry, has to try and soothe the rough spots of Evangelical opulence by comparing it to a religious/political entity with an almost-2,000 year history, well then I'd say that reflects a whole lot more on Evangelical excesses than Catholic excesses.

[Soundbear]

RGWR always wants to argue who is worse.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> If someone, such as Barry, has to try and soothe the rough spots of Evangelical opulence by comparing it to a religious/political entity with an almost-2,000 year history, well then I'd say that reflects a whole lot more on Evangelical excesses than Catholic excesses.

</div></div>

Please, mods... We need that spit-take icon..
in the meantime, this will have to do..
/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/crazy.gif

[GenX]

Hit a nerve, eh??? /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

Yeah,, what's that nerve called that we refer to as the funny bone?

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

[GenX]

The Protestanta Reformationa Theologia bone?

[Verotik]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Vatican City is a political entity.

Those thousands upon thousands of opulent houses owned by countless Protestant evangelists are a totally different situation than Vatican City.

The ruins of many a poor soul who was bilked out of their life savings lie in the trail of deceit and destruction blazed by Protestant televangelists. </div></div>

lol so the catholic church has never murdered anyone and taken all their property?

[GenX]

And I said that...when?