PDA

View Full Version : Seal hunt



Pages : [1] 2

Macs II
04-03-2008, 11:32 PM
Do you think this should be stopped or is it needed as some say?

Wach this as reported by Aljazeera (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czW8kdU7geM)

jaydee
04-03-2008, 11:35 PM
awwww poor animals /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

Barney Rubble
04-03-2008, 11:48 PM
just think of them as dogs, Macs!!

Macs II
04-03-2008, 11:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

jaydee
04-03-2008, 11:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:02 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:05 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished

Larimar
04-04-2008, 12:05 AM
All I will say is that I'm against the seal hunt and I don't personally support hunting or the slaughter of any life at any time for any reason. That's a personal moral I have and I don't judge those of other beliefs.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:15 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:17 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed </div></div>

dats funny cause i never saw one

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed </div></div>

dats funny cause i never saw one </div></div>

I've seen a few and they can be a real problem

Larimar
04-04-2008, 12:24 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed </div></div>

What about alternatives like relocation? Instead of guns, cages and a new home somewhere else?
Many animals elsewhere are also humanely "neutered" and tagged. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Just wanted to add, I also think over population is kinda the wrong way to say it-I mean, isn't it really about human population? Our population goes up and 300 bears is considered a lot after we tear down their homes. Really, 300-500 even 600..is not a lot. I don't kno wthe population in the sault, but I would think people just like to hunt-It gives society money instead of costing it and many ppl enjoy it. I don't think it's the best solution tho.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:30 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed </div></div>

What about alternatives like relocation? Instead of guns, cages and a new home somewhere else?
Many animals elsewhere are also humanely "neutered" and tagged. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

That's fine but when you take 10 away 15 more take their place ....overpopulation is never a good thing

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:33 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barney Rubble</div><div class="ubbcode-body">just think of them as dogs, Macs!! </div></div>


Sorry to disappoint you but just because I don't want someones dog pooping on my lawn doesn't mean I hate animals. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif </div></div>

well, if you dont like the seal hunt then people shouldnt be allowed to hunt as a sport, animals i mean like birds,bears,moose,deer same thing there they should cut the whole sport of hunting away </div></div>

I don't hunt or fish so it wouldn't matter to me if they did lol
However some hunting is needed to control animal population so I'm not against it. </div></div>

i understand they need to hunt for food for us like the meat and all but im saying the unnecessary hunting, like the sport of it, just for nothing is not necessary and should be abolished </div></div>

we all know what happened when they canceled the spring bear hunt ...bears all over the city ...I still say some hunting is needed </div></div>

What about alternatives like relocation? Instead of guns, cages and a new home somewhere else?
Many animals elsewhere are also humanely "neutered" and tagged. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

Just wanted to add, I also think over population is kinda the wrong way to say it-I mean, isn't it really about human population? Our population goes up and 300 bears is considered a lot after we tear down their homes. Really, 300-500 even 600..is not a lot. I don't kno wthe population in the sault, but I would think people just like to hunt-It gives society money instead of costing it and many ppl enjoy it. I don't think it's the best solution tho. </div></div>

its not the best solution... its barbaric.

IMHO
04-04-2008, 12:34 AM
A seal has to die to give some rich [censored] a coat..only in Canada.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:35 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Thinking Hard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A seal has to die to give some rich [censored] a coat..only in Canada. </div></div>

no need for fur coats

Larimar
04-04-2008, 12:35 AM
Macs, There is a birth control method that can be placed in the food of animals now. It only affects the females and they can't overdose on it. What it comes down to is the fact that people enjoy hunting and they aren't going to give up a hobby that let's stores sell products.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:36 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Thinking Hard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A seal has to die to give some rich [censored] a coat..only in Canada. </div></div>

thats true ...U.S banned Canadian seal products in 1972

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:37 AM
only primitve barbaric ppl like to hunt

dancingqueen
04-04-2008, 12:37 AM
I think it is wrong simply because of the method it is being done, When you hunt, you do it humanely, a bullet through the head or even at the very least slitting the throat if it was not a clean kill, but these animals where still twitching when they where getting their guts torn out! Besides which, hunting is still at least somewhat limited, you are not killing deer left, right and cente leaving the forest floor covered in their blood.

dancingqueen
04-04-2008, 12:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Thinking Hard</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A seal has to die to give some rich [censored] a coat..only in Canada. </div></div>

no need for fur coats </div></div>
fur coats are ugly anyways, like hello, wanna come back to this melenia?

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:43 AM
fur coats can be made out of man made materials that are even better than real animal fur

SusyQ
04-04-2008, 12:43 AM
GAWD if they have too do it can they not point blank shoot it instead of clubing six times before it takes its last breath.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:46 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SusyQ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">GAWD if they have too do it can they not point blank shoot it instead of clubing six times before it takes its last breath. </div></div>

ITS DISGUSTING and inhumane

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:48 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: SusyQ</div><div class="ubbcode-body">GAWD if they have too do it can they not point blank shoot it instead of clubing six times before it takes its last breath. </div></div>

If you shoot them there's blood and that will ruin the fur ...that's why they club them

Larimar
04-04-2008, 12:50 AM
Moochi, ....do you eat meat that comes from animals that come from factory farms where they are cruelly treated until their death?
Just wondering...b.c I know seals are cuter than cows and chicks...but If you feel that strongly about animals being slaughtered inhumanely you may want to consider my point-and a healtheir diet /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
But I shall say no more!-your choice.

SusyQ
04-04-2008, 12:50 AM
OIC

riggs
04-04-2008, 12:53 AM
It's nothing more than a quick fix to compensate for poor laws regarding polluting and the diminished fish stocks.

If the world governments truly cared about this planet they would find a better way to find balance.But this will never happen as the need for greed truly outweighs our need to want to live in harmony with our environment.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 12:54 AM
does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:54 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Moochi, ....do you eat meat that comes from animals that come from factory farms where they are cruelly treated until their death?
Just wondering...b.c I know seals are cuter than cows and chicks...but If you feel that strongly about animals being slaughtered inhumanely you may want to consider my point-and a healtheir diet /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
But I shall say no more!-your choice. </div></div>

ill never be a vegan, and technically hurting plants is wrong too but we wont go there. yes, i am a heavy meat eater but this doesnt mean i like the senseless slughtering of animals for the sport of it, the fun of it. if its for a reason its ok with me but not just to see how good i am at aiming , kill somehting and let it rot away.

i will not change my eating habits for this. i have never liked guns and hunting, my friend brought me to hius camp where was the first time i saw a shotgun up close, heck we even went bird hunting for parttridge. i didnt like it but hey he went so i tagged along. i went with him but doesnt mean that i agree with it. bottom line, how will we get out required protein and iron if we dont eat meat? vegans are very weak people and you cant live like that really, at least i cant

riggs
04-04-2008, 12:56 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>

I'm sure none of the slaughter houses are a pretty sight.

dancingqueen
04-04-2008, 12:58 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>
not a clue

jaydee
04-04-2008, 12:59 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>

not sure but i do like pork and sausages

dancingqueen
04-04-2008, 12:59 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: riggs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>

I'm sure none of the slaughter houses are a pretty sight. </div></div>
I think the biggest problem I, and many others have with it is the method to which it is done, and the purpose.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 01:00 AM
i know that groound veal is bad. i mean the meat is good but the animnals are killed to prematurely and too young its bad, and if they get older its ground beef. i mean the meat is good and all but sometimes the ways in which they slaughter them are bad

Kittie
04-04-2008, 01:01 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: riggs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>

I'm sure none of the slaughter houses are a pretty sight. </div></div>
I think the biggest problem I, and many others have with it is the method to which it is done, and the purpose.</div></div>

Exactly.

riggs
04-04-2008, 01:02 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: riggs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>

I'm sure none of the slaughter houses are a pretty sight. </div></div>
I think the biggest problem I, and many others have with it is the method to which it is done, and the purpose. </div></div>

It's all based on production numbers and therefore profit.I'm sure cruelty is not in they're vocabulary.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 01:04 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>
not a clue </div></div>

They are given a drug to relax them and then they go on a line and have their throat slit open

SusyQ
04-04-2008, 01:04 AM
/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/sick.gif damn

riggs
04-04-2008, 01:05 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">does anyone know how pigs are killed ....I do ..just wandering is anyone else does </div></div>
not a clue </div></div>

They are given a drug to relax them and then they go on a line and have their throat slit open </div></div>

Oh that should help me sleep tonite..... /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

Larimar
04-04-2008, 01:06 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Moochi, ....do you eat meat that comes from animals that come from factory farms where they are cruelly treated until their death?
Just wondering...b.c I know seals are cuter than cows and chicks...but If you feel that strongly about animals being slaughtered inhumanely you may want to consider my point-and a healtheir diet /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
But I shall say no more!-your choice. </div></div>

ill never be a vegan, and technically hurting plants is wrong too but we wont go there. yes, i am a heavy meat eater but this doesnt mean i like the senseless slughtering of animals for the sport of it, the fun of it. if its for a reason its ok with me but not just to see how good i am at aiming , kill somehting and let it rot away.

i will not change my eating habits for this. i have never liked guns and hunting, my friend brought me to hius camp where was the first time i saw a shotgun up close, heck we even went bird hunting for parttridge. i didnt like it but hey he went so i tagged along. i went with him but doesnt mean that i agree with it. bottom line, how will we get out required protein and iron if we dont eat meat? vegans are very weak people and you cant live like that really, at least i cant </div></div>
vegen is a bit extreme, but I wasn't suggesting to change your eating habits-It was a way to spark your thoughts on your own hypocracy. We no longer are dealing with family farms which did humanely slaughter animals for your consumption. We are now talking about needless suffering of animals for meat which most doesn't make it to a person's plate but to the garbage.
They are hooked to machines, amputated and living in their own manure. Not only is this unneccesary, but it's very cruel-MUCH more cruel than a seal hunt on the scale of things. The seal hunters also eat the seals as well, so yes ..saying the killing of a seal and not your cow or chicken is cruel doesn't hold much ground..
It's only for the sole reason that baby seals are cute and fluffy that we pay any attention to this mass slaughter and not to our own problem which closed down thousands of family farms and put family's out of work.
Seal hunting Is no different then what people take part in everyday by buying from factory farms-it supports cruelty.
We once had people tending to the sheep, and chickens were able to have a feild or a pen to roam in...now they sit in their own dung-which..really can't be very yummy-no wonder there's so many diseased meats lately.
So yah..I'm not against ppl eating meat..but I do think it's important to realize that there's no higher ground between what you get at the grocery store and that seal meat. I'm against both...please keep in mind-I'm not against other ppl eating meat-I just wish they went back to old ways and stopped the cruelty-it would also give back family's their jobs and livelyhoods as well as stop all that food from being wasted and thrown out..

jaydee
04-04-2008, 01:06 AM
hunting, seal hunt completely unnecessary

KWB
04-04-2008, 01:11 AM
SEALS ???????????? WHAT ABOUT THE CORMORANTS

Larimar
04-04-2008, 01:15 AM
http://youtube.com/watch?v=_FH8AQzk4HM&feature=related

For people who honestly hav eno idea what a factory farm is-this is it..but WARNING-do not watch if you are already aware or if you can't stand watching animal cruelty...it's by no means easy on the eyes..Even I wont watch it..but I think some ppl here really, truly, don't understand that seal hunting and factory farms are in the same cruel category.. so we do need to work on ourselves before others-what's that jesusy quote? to get the speck outta our own eyes before the other persons??

jaydee
04-04-2008, 01:15 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SEALS ???????????? WHAT ABOUT THE CORMAROTS </div></div>

CORMORANTS???

Macs II
04-04-2008, 01:17 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SEALS ???????????? WHAT ABOUT THE CORMAROTS </div></div>

CORMORANTS??? </div></div>

beats me /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

Larimar
04-04-2008, 01:18 AM
Anyways folks, I'm going to leave for the night *yawnz*
nite.
......dream the dreams of seals.

SusyQ
04-04-2008, 01:20 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SEALS ???????????? WHAT ABOUT THE CORMAROTS </div></div>

CORMORANTS??? </div></div>

beats me /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

Its from the bird family Phalacrocoracidae.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 01:21 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KWB</div><div class="ubbcode-body">SEALS ???????????? WHAT ABOUT THE CORMAROTS </div></div>

CORMORANTS??? </div></div>

beats me /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

whats going on wit the cormorants, hunted down too?

Macs II
04-04-2008, 01:48 AM
beam me up Scotty

jaydee
04-04-2008, 03:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beam me up Scotty </div></div>

i find it funny how youd make that comment, a buddy in blackjack on facebook said that same thing tonight

Super Gram
04-04-2008, 11:24 AM
I don't like the seal hunt either.It's dangerous for the seal hunters too. But it is necessary.

(1) This is the only living these people make for the whole year.

(2).Most of the furs are now sold in Europe.

(3) These hunters and their family eat and sell the seal meat. Its popular in Europe

(4) Most important each seal eats about 100 pounds of fish per day. If they don't cull them there will be no fish and all the seals will die.

They are allowed so many seal pups. Then so many year olds and last they go and can kill some adult seals. Their catch is monitored by the government.

I know killing any animals I don't care for.........but we fish, hunt moose, deer but only to keep them from over running us like the bears are doing.The new method of sealing is not like it used to be. The films you see are old ones that are put out by the seal protesters..........they want you to think the new way is still the same as the old. I have seen some new sealing film and most hunters now shoot them

riggs
04-04-2008, 11:53 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: *Super Gram*</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't like the seal hunt either.It's dangerous for the seal hunters too. But it is necessary.

(1) This is the only living these people make for the whole year.

(2).Most of the furs are now sold in Europe.

(3) These hunters and their family eat and sell the seal meat. Its popular in Europe

(4) Most important each seal eats about 100 pounds of fish per day. If they don't cull them there will be no fish and all the seals will die.

They are allowed so many seal pups. Then so many year olds and last they go and can kill some adult seals. Their catch is monitored by the government.

I know killing any animals I don't care for.........but we fish, hunt moose, deer but only to keep them from over running us like the bears are doing.The new method of sealing is not like it used to be. The films you see are old ones that are put out by the seal protesters..........they want you to think the new way is still the same as the old. I have seen some new sealing film and most hunters now shoot them


</div></div>

I understand the point you're making about earning a living but you need to consider the fact that this world is ever changing in this regard.We are the imperfect balance on earth therefore this is being done to compensate for our poor practices regarding how we manage the environment.In the perfect world ( which we are not )population and pollution has put a strain on our oceans and lakes which we know diminishes the fish stocks.But how much damage has been done to their reproduction cycles and spawning areas because of our carelessness or greed? I would hazard to guess that in itself is quite extensive.

As for making a living,no one is happy to see someone struggle because lack of employment but entire industries have collapsed or altered their practices or products to keep up with the changing world around them.

I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments were truly trying to preserve our resources.They are trying to rebound our fish stocks through methods that are only eliminating a predator.The prey will rebound slightly but not to the healthy levels they would if we were serious about protecting their environment.

J*B
04-04-2008, 12:18 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beam me up Scotty </div></div>

i find it funny how youd make that comment, a buddy in blackjack on facebook said that same thing tonight </div></div>


/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif Go figure

§ienna
04-04-2008, 02:34 PM
I knew this went on, but it still makes me ill. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/sick.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/frown.gif

kitca
04-04-2008, 02:59 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: riggs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: *Super Gram*</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't like the seal hunt either.It's dangerous for the seal hunters too. But it is necessary.

(1) This is the only living these people make for the whole year.

(2).Most of the furs are now sold in Europe.

(3) These hunters and their family eat and sell the seal meat. Its popular in Europe

(4) Most important each seal eats about 100 pounds of fish per day. If they don't cull them there will be no fish and all the seals will die.

They are allowed so many seal pups. Then so many year olds and last they go and can kill some adult seals. Their catch is monitored by the government.

I know killing any animals I don't care for.........but we fish, hunt moose, deer but only to keep them from over running us like the bears are doing.The new method of sealing is not like it used to be. The films you see are old ones that are put out by the seal protesters..........they want you to think the new way is still the same as the old. I have seen some new sealing film and most hunters now shoot them


</div></div>

I understand the point you're making about earning a living but you need to consider the fact that this world is ever changing in this regard.We are the imperfect balance on earth therefore this is being done to compensate for our poor practices regarding how we manage the environment.In the perfect world ( which we are not )population and pollution has put a strain on our oceans and lakes which we know diminishes the fish stocks.But how much damage has been done to their reproduction cycles and spawning areas because of our carelessness or greed? I would hazard to guess that in itself is quite extensive.

As for making a living,no one is happy to see someone struggle because lack of employment but entire industries have collapsed or altered their practices or products to keep up with the changing world around them.

I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments were truly trying to preserve our resources.They are trying to rebound our fish stocks through methods that are only eliminating a predator.The prey will rebound slightly but not to the healthy levels they would if we were serious about protecting their environment. </div></div>

riggs, ithink that was very well said.

i certainly agree with redrose and the factoryfarming horrific practises that are going on. i dont think it is an issue just because baby seals are cute, i think it is more than that. the fact that they are just babies, that they are sometimes skinned alive. also, whoever said that the meat was taken and eaten, im not sure, ive only seen footage where the skin was taken and the animal left.

i completely disagree that the seals are the reason for declining fish 'stocks'. OVERFISHING and total waste fishing at a commercial rate is the problem, not a natural preditor.

she
04-04-2008, 04:34 PM
Study after study by reputable, international veterinarians have shown time after time that skinning alive is a lie perpetrated by so called independent studies conducted, paid for and written by the staff members of animal rights groups and never peer group reviewed for methodology or accuracy.

What looks ugly is not wrong. If ugly is portrayed as wrong and pretty is portrayed as right there is a large segment of the world’s human population which needs to seek cover. Ugly and pretty have no moral value, they are simply in the eye of the beholder.

she
04-04-2008, 04:41 PM
Riggs said....."I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments were truly trying to preserve our resources.They are trying to rebound our fish stocks through methods that are only eliminating a predator.The prey will rebound slightly but not to the healthy levels they would if we were serious about protecting their environment. "

but....

Canadian sealers, Canadian marine mammal biologists and the Canadian Government are world leaders in the field of resource utilization using scientific management principles combined with an educated workforce and a strict monitoring protocol to ensure the continued viability of sealing from both the economic and species perspectives. Canada is a world leader in the sustainable use of natural, renewable resources.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 05:19 PM
(1) This is the only living these people make for the whole year.

And that's what it comes down to-"money" exploitation.
Not population control.
"An incessant desire and greed for the profits to be made from the seal's oil and pelts drove many men and businesses into a pathetic circle of death and despair for most involved. (Sealing was an extremely dangerous business throughout history and many sealers lost their lives while pursuing their sealing livelihood.)"

From that work, ONLY A FEW WEALTHY men gain a lot of profit from those men hard work.
Most countries and cities and states and provinces do just fine without hunting for a living-They get Jobs.So ..really bad excuse.






(4) Most important each seal eats about 100 pounds of fish per day. If they don't cull them there will be no fish and all the seals will die.--MYTH. Has no grounds of truth.
They eat a variety of different fish. The humans fish for Cod which makes up only 3% of their diet. Mostly the seals will eat the predators of cod which would help the fishing industry.
So again..very HUGE myth just to make ppl feel better about the slaughter.

"
"There is not a shred of credible evidence to suggest that killing harp seals will bring back fish stocks. Human overfishing caused the collapse of groundfish stocks, and human overfishing is preventing their return. Seals are a convenient scapegoat for the fishing industry, providing a distraction from the destructive commercial fishing practices that continue today.

Seals, like all marine mammals, are a vital part of the ecosystem of the northwest Atlantic and help all fish populations to thrive. Moreover, harp seals are opportunistic feeders, consuming small amounts of many species. While commercially fished cod stocks may account for about 3 percent of their diets, harp seals also consume many significant predators of cod, including squid. Even the Canadian Department of Fisheries and Oceans admits that there is no evidence killing seals will help bring fish stocks back—and their latest research shows the opposite may be the case.""

the seals didn't cause the fishery collapse and the seals aren't going to keep it from coming back!
Interestingly, in 2005, EVEN THE DFO NOW REFUTES ITS OWN PREVIOUS PROPAGANDA AND ADMITS THAT THE SEALS DIDN'T CAUSE THE COLLAPSE OF THE COD FISHERY!
(yes, its true... although hard to locate and constantly changing locations on their website, they will now reluctantly state this un-arguable fact as needed to appease powerful scientists or a hungry media in times of political necessity)...


"Newfoundland's fishery has never been wealthier, earning nearly $200 million more annually than it did prior to the 1992 cod collapse. This economic growth is because of the expansion of the shellfish industry, which today accounts for 80 percent of the value of Newfoundland's fishery. Sealing, in contrast, brings in only 2 percent. Revenues from the hunt account for less than one-half of 1 percent of the province's economy."
--So NO it does not help them earn a living...They could earn a better one fishing for shellfish

Saying that skinning seals alive is a myth is wrong. Anytime you club something on the head you run the risk that it IS alive still. They skin them right away so they do not wait to find out. The risk is always there in that circumstance. It's common sense. As recent as 2005-there is footage as proof.

" In 2001, an independent veterinary panel performed post-mortems on seal carcasses abandoned on the ice floes. Their report concluded that in 42 percent of cases, the seals did not show enough evidence of cranial injury to even guarantee unconsciousness at the time of skinning. This report is supported by the testimony of independent journalists, parliamentarians and scientists who observe and document the commercial seal hunt each year. Footage from the commercial seal hunt consistently shows conscious pups stabbed with boathooks and dragged across the ice, wounded pups left to choke on their own blood and conscious seal pups cut open. Video footage of the 2005 hunt can be viewed at http://www.protectseals.org. "
How ppl can deny the evidence is beyond me. It's one thing to be for the seal hunt, it' another to deny the inhumanity.




Those that are well aware of the polar bear decline due to the ice melting-should then understand that the seal population is already being taken care of. Pups have been falling through the ice and drowning due to global warming. Adding to this the seal hunt-We are likely to bring about the death of another species eventually, all for the sake of money. Making the wealthier more wealthy and the poor to struggle and slaughter the animals b.c they think that's the only way they can make a decent living. "Harp seals already have many natural predators, including sharks, whales and polar bears—and now the seals have a new threat to contend with—climate change. As the ice cover the harp seals need to give birth and nurse their pups on rapidly begins to disappear, the population will face devastating rates of natural mortalities. Those advocating a cull of harp seals are ignoring sound science and common sense. "
It is also true that humans are falling through the ice and dying now as well-as a result of this seal hunt. It is not safe and is NOT worth losing your life, your father, or your family member!


There's really no true logical reason for the seal hunt other than tradition is hard to kick and that people like to kill animals. Some hunters started at a pre teen age and were told to slaughter baby seals. They were raised to feel cruelty was okay.
It has nothing to do with making THEM money-b.c it doesnt, it has nothing to do with the population "so called problem" b.c it doesn't exist, and it certainly doesn't have to do with the fish since the seals will gladly eat the predators-we just fish too much.

cheers

http://www.hsicanada.ca/seals/seal_myths_and_facts.html

SusyQ
04-04-2008, 05:21 PM
Your one smart cookie RedRose.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 05:35 PM
I want to add this video for non-believers..for ppl who think the seal hunts inhumanity is lumped with Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny. Please PLEASE if you already know how cruel it is-DON'T click this link unless you can handle the truth and want to pass that truth on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhVUNKR6-7A


This was taken in 2005- of the after effects of the seal hunt!
How anyone can watch that and then say the seals are never left alive-is again, Beyond my understanding!

That video shows the seal hunters as well. It just looks like a group of ppl who are trying to help the seals are filming.

Again..WARNING: don't watch if you are sensitive.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 05:37 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: JB</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">beam me up Scotty </div></div>

i find it funny how youd make that comment, a buddy in blackjack on facebook said that same thing tonight </div></div>


/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/confused.gif Go figure </div></div>

yeah after i made 300,000 on that game /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

jaydee
04-04-2008, 05:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I want to add this video for non-believers..for ppl who think the seal hunts inhumanity is lumped with Santa Clause and the Easter Bunny. Please PLEASE if you already know how cruel it is-DON'T click this link unless you can handle the truth and want to pass that truth on.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bhVUNKR6-7A


This was taken in 2005- of the after effects of the seal hunt!
How anyone can watch that and then say the seals are never left alive-is again, Beyond my understanding!

That video shows the seal hunters as well. It just looks like a group of ppl who are trying to help the seals are filming.

Again..WARNING: don't watch if you are sensitive. </div></div>

i dont watch any of it. ignorance is bliss for sure. i find it all disgusting and wrong, just as bad as seeing how a pig is killed, the meat is good yes but i dont wanna see the process to get that food.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 05:41 PM
Moochi, It would seem that you really are not ignorant to the cruelty, you just do not want to witness it first hand. I'm sure there are people though, that don't believe anything bad happens on these hunts and probably won't watch the video-continuing their uninformed opinion. That truly is a tragedy.

she
04-04-2008, 06:12 PM
March 10, 2008 recent info

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=364221

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:14 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Moochi, It would seem that you really are not ignorant to the cruelty, you just do not want to witness it first hand. I'm sure there are people though, that don't believe anything bad happens on these hunts and probably won't watch the video-continuing their uninformed opinion. That truly is a tragedy. </div></div>

we dont eat seals so theres no reason for this to happen

Larimar
04-04-2008, 06:24 PM
Correction: Humans in Canada don't need to eat seals-but they do...ew

Larimar
04-04-2008, 06:28 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">March 10, 2008 recent info

http://www.nationalpost.com/news/canada/story.html?id=364221 </div></div>
There were standards in place for the 2005 video I had placed up as well. Just b.c ppl make standards and guidelines, doesn't mean people follow them or understand the difference between a dead seal and just an unconcious one. The educational backgrounds of these people are that of fishermen, not veterinarians. When they do not follow the rules, (for example when they kill more seals than the quota) The law does nothing.
Big surprise there though.
Harp seals have to reach age 6 at the least but mostly age 7 before even being abl eto give birth.
It then takes 12 months to carry the baby seal.
the Harp Seal only lives up to the age of 30 in the best of conditions.
We certainly won't see the impact of this culling for quite a few years, but with global warming and nature taking care of itself-we will soon see the impact.



We may not know the true impact of the seal hunt until that time

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:37 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Correction: Humans in Canada don't need to eat seals-but they do...ew </div></div>

then what kinda foods are ok to eat then, like practically and all

she
04-04-2008, 06:40 PM
Threads like this one are great. I cannot say I am 100% for or 100% against the seal hunt. Education and awareness of BOTH sides is what I view as important.

she
04-04-2008, 06:43 PM
This link is for Moooochi......
http://www.fica.k12.nf.ca/Grassroots/doti/sealing_recipes.htm

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:43 PM
if we cant eat meat, cant eat plants then what do we eat?

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:44 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">This link is for Moooochi......
http://www.fica.k12.nf.ca/Grassroots/doti/sealing_recipes.htm </div></div>
thats babrbaric, thats just wrong

Larimar
04-04-2008, 06:47 PM
huh, why can't you eat plants? They don't have a mother or father, they don't feel pain, and the arguement that they do is used by people who don't understand how they work and really can't think of any other arguements for vegetarians..which is sad..
Plants, grains, fruits, nuts, eggs, soy, etc..are yummy-seal meat is a bit ew still to me.

she
04-04-2008, 06:48 PM
Personally I find lamb chops and white veal barbaric but many dont even give it a second thought.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Plants, grains, fruits, nuts, eggs, soy, etc..are yummy-seal meat is a bit ew still to me. </div></div>

technically a plant is alive too, so its wrong to kill the plant from its foundation to eat it, if you wanna go there so, you cant win either way. we just need to eat the meat and veggies from history that gave us, chicken, beef, milk etc etc but seals is no need to eat them i think

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:53 PM
and fish is it ok to eat fish..? apparently in the Bible Jesus ate fish and bread

Larimar
04-04-2008, 06:54 PM
She-I do. I find all slaughter barbaric. Humans don't even have a digestive tract for meat. Predators have a quick digestive tract to eat meat, but it takes humans 40 hours to digest it. Maing humans susceptable to disease. We also have canines similar to that of a horse-to pierce fruits and chew grains, but there's no way we could rip into raw hide with them.
Logically/scientifically-I do not believe in eating meat but yeah, I also am a vegetarian b.c it is cruel.
I still don't judge people for eating meat, I too ate it for many years until I had my eyes opened. But People are raised to eat it, so I'm hoping that one day it will at least be done humanely. A lion hunts and kills in a more humane way than a human does these days.

Macs II
04-04-2008, 06:55 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Plants, grains, fruits, nuts, eggs, soy, etc..are yummy-seal meat is a bit ew still to me. </div></div>

technically a plant is alive too, so its wrong to kill the plant from its foundation to eat it, if you wanna go there so, you cant win either way. we just need to eat the meat and veggies from history that gave us, chicken, beef, milk etc etc but seals is no need to eat them i think </div></div>

what makes seals more special than chicken,cow or a pig? There's no need to eat any of them to survive but people do ..so if someone wants to eat seal meat so what.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:57 PM
uhhh if humans dont get their required protein doses we turn weak and limp. if you want some sort of form orr body you need to eat healthy and unfortunately humans are made of protein from animals and vitamins from plants what other way can we do it. abstain from eating meat then we fall apart

she
04-04-2008, 06:58 PM
The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?

jaydee
04-04-2008, 06:58 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Plants, grains, fruits, nuts, eggs, soy, etc..are yummy-seal meat is a bit ew still to me. </div></div>

technically a plant is alive too, so its wrong to kill the plant from its foundation to eat it, if you wanna go there so, you cant win either way. we just need to eat the meat and veggies from history that gave us, chicken, beef, milk etc etc but seals is no need to eat them i think </div></div>

what makes seals more special than chicken,cow or a pig? There's no need to eat any of them to survive but people do ..so if someone wants to eat seal meat so what. </div></div>

thats just what history passed down to us. i dont really see seal anywhere there, or else it would be a common dish on todays supper tables.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 06:59 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
Plants, grains, fruits, nuts, eggs, soy, etc..are yummy-seal meat is a bit ew still to me. </div></div>

technically a plant is alive too, so its wrong to kill the plant from its foundation to eat it, if you wanna go there so, you cant win either way. we just need to eat the meat and veggies from history that gave us, chicken, beef, milk etc etc but seals is no need to eat them i think </div></div>
Actually, if you read my above post you'd see I just called that arguement out as pathetic. It has no grounds of truth. A plant is alive but does not have a central nervous system similar to that of humans and nonhuman animals. Trees actually want their fruit to fall and to spread the seeds for procreation.

Yes plants are alive, they respond to chemical changes and sunlight, and they die...but to say they feel emotions, pain, and suffer the same as an animal is a pathetic attempt to win an arguement. I won't beat around the bush with that.
"Plants are alive, but it's just not the same thing as an animal. Cut a piece off of a plant, stick it in the ground, and it might grow into a new plant. Try doing that with an animal."

and as far as Jesus eating fish-I'm not a bible follower, and not all religions believe in eating meat. It is also debated whether fish is translated correctly in the bible. but taht's another topic to discuss and battle over..

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:00 PM
say what you want you become vegan you have no energy, are weak, small and all maybe a woman can get away with that but i sure as heck cant. if it were up to me, id eat and just eat meat, nothing else. i know some ppl like that after all all we need is protein and we get enoughr from the meat that we eat.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:03 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

</div></div>

eating fat and blubber, are we even able to do so? do we have the required teeth and digestive system? inuits eat off the land, very primitiv and simple, i just think it would be a big change to get eveyone to eat that, andm ost wont even like it. in a day where taste matters, with all the additives in foods nowdays to make them keep longer i know it could be bad to our systems but which way do we have it, a good tasting food or gross blubber thats good for you? we then become like camp living off the land, we regress backwards

Larimar
04-04-2008, 07:05 PM
"what makes seals more special than chicken,cow or a pig? There's no need to eat any of them to survive but people do ..so if someone wants to eat seal meat so what. "

I don't eat cows and chickens, so I'm unsure what your point is to me?

"uhhh if humans dont get their required protein doses we turn weak and limp. if you want some sort of form orr body you need to eat healthy and unfortunately humans are made of protein from animals and vitamins from plants what other way can we do it. abstain from eating meat then we fall apart "

Humans get an overdose of protein usually-with fastfoods now available. You need about "roughly" 46 grams of protein a day. There is protein in bread, grains, pasta, fruits, and veges- by the time I eat this I get roughly 20 grams of protien, give or take..and then soy and eggs finish it off for me.

People who eat meat for breakfast , lunch, and dinner are probably peeing out the rest of the protein that goes unused. There's a lot of myths about proteins and I suggest you research it before making claims. As I said, I'm not trying to debat eyou-I don't care if you eat meat-my point is though, that it's a cheap arguement to use against vegetarians, when they are perfectly healthy. PERFECTLY healthy-BODYBUILDERS have stated they are vegetarians.so don't spew crap :p
There's no reason to try and fight vegetarians..just concentrate on making your hunts and farms as humane as possible. That's all I say.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:07 PM
ok but i wonder how much more healthy inuit people are compared to the rest of us.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:10 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Humans get an overdose of protein usually-with fastfoods now available. You need about "roughly" 46 grams of protein a day. There is protein in bread, grains, pasta, fruits, and veges- by the time I eat this I get roughly 20 grams of protien, give or take..and then soy and eggs finish it off for me.
</div></div>

fast food protein isnt good protein. just like the ones from pasta and veggies its not as good as protein from cheese, and meat. i for one keep away from fast food diet, and like to eat healthy most times. i have abstained from eating meats before and i was 140 lbs. now im like 213 and feel a heck lot better and look better so go figure, a guy that looks like a skinny nothing to some sort of form. what gives me this form is the foods i eat, im a meat eater lunhc meats, fish, chicken, pork chops, beef burgers steaks whatever eggs , milk cheese i eat it all in moderation mind ya, i cant see it anyother way.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 07:12 PM
I found this Yahoo Answer educationl:
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071105195836AAT6bS4
Many Inuit people eat a standard western diet.


"Impressed, the explorer Vilhjalmur Stefansson adopted an Eskimo-style diet for five years during the two Arctic expeditions he led between 1908 and 1918. “The thing to do is to find your antiscorbutics where you are,” he wrote. “Pick them up as you go.” In 1928, to convince skeptics, he and a young colleague spent a year on an Americanized version of the diet under medical supervision at Bellevue Hospital in New York City. The pair ate steaks, chops, organ meats like brain and liver, poultry, fish, and fat with gusto. “If you have some fresh meat in your diet every day and don’t overcook it,” Stefansson declared triumphantly, “there will be enough C from that source alone to prevent scurvy.”"

Humans are a very adaptive species. I mean, we've been living on animal proteins for a long, long time even though it's really not ideal for our health. What's really fascinating is that the closer we get to an ideal diet (a strict vegetarian diet) incidents of disease go way, way down and people tend to live much longer. The farther we get from that ideal diet the more disease occurs and the younger people die. The Inuits, although they can subsist on a traditional Inuit diet high in fat and without the rest of the foods that we would consider necessary for a balanced diet, are known for having many more health problems and the average life expectancy for an Inuit male is only 62. This is hardly a good arguement for continuing to eat a diet high in fat and lacking in veggies!"

she
04-04-2008, 07:13 PM
http://www.thesealfishery.com/media.php another video,, worth watching till the end............

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:15 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I found this Yahoo Answer educationl:
http://answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20071105195836AAT6bS4
Many Inuit people eat a standard western diet.


"Impressed, the explorer Vilhjalmur Stefansson adopted an Eskimo-style diet for five years during the two Arctic expeditions he led between 1908 and 1918. “The thing to do is to find your antiscorbutics where you are,” he wrote. “Pick them up as you go.” In 1928, to convince skeptics, he and a young colleague spent a year on an Americanized version of the diet under medical supervision at Bellevue Hospital in New York City. The pair ate steaks, chops, organ meats like brain and liver, poultry, fish, and fat with gusto. “If you have some fresh meat in your diet every day and don’t overcook it,” Stefansson declared triumphantly, “there will be enough C from that source alone to prevent scurvy.”"

Humans are a very adaptive species. I mean, we've been living on animal proteins for a long, long time even though it's really not ideal for our health. What's really fascinating is that the closer we get to an ideal diet (a strict vegetarian diet) incidents of disease go way, way down and people tend to live much longer. The farther we get from that ideal diet the more disease occurs and the younger people die. The Inuits, although they can subsist on a traditional Inuit diet high in fat and without the rest of the foods that we would consider necessary for a balanced diet, are known for having many more health problems and the average life expectancy for an Inuit male is only 62. This is hardly a good arguement for continuing to eat a diet high in fat and lacking in veggies!" </div></div>

well ok then guess Macs should change to eat Whale blubber then /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

Larimar
04-04-2008, 07:16 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Humans get an overdose of protein usually-with fastfoods now available. You need about "roughly" 46 grams of protein a day. There is protein in bread, grains, pasta, fruits, and veges- by the time I eat this I get roughly 20 grams of protien, give or take..and then soy and eggs finish it off for me.
</div></div>

fast food protein isnt good protein. just like the ones from pasta and veggies its not as good as protein from cheese, and meat. i for one keep away from fast food diet, and like to eat healthy most times. i have abstained from eating meats before and i was 140 lbs. now im like 213 and feel a heck lot better and look better so go figure, a guy that looks like a skinny nothing to some sort of form. what gives me this form is the foods i eat, im a meat eater lunhc meats, fish, chicken, pork chops, beef burgers steaks whatever eggs , milk cheese i eat it all in moderation mind ya, i cant see it anyother way. </div></div>

The point is, saying that vegetarians are weak and not getting enough protein and iron is a CHEAP shot that has no grounds of truth in it. There IS sufficient protein available in soy, eggs, tofu, nuts, cheese, AND veges (Beans for example, spinach for example). To say they are weak is a rude ignorant comment.
Yes, fast food is bad-but YES people ARE getting protein overdoses in this Westernized life. All you hav eto do is count the grams of protein in each meal and if it goes over 40 you got too much. For baby's over 20 (something) is too much. Getting too much protein is not harmful, the point is tho, that we are lead to believe that we need A LOT to be healthy-it's untrue. There's also a myth about incomplete proteins..you can look up that on google along with the books misprint and apologies.

Please get back on topic now, it isn't a debate about how "weak" vegetarians are-it is a thread on the seal hunt.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:19 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The point is, saying that vegetarians are weak and not getting enough protein and iron is a CHEAP shot that has no grounds of truth in it. There IS sufficient protein available in soy, eggs, tofu, nuts, cheese, AND veges (Beans for example, spinach for example). To say they are weak is a rude ignorant comment.
</div></div>

ok i take the weak comment back but say that to bodybuilders and see how far they get with tofu

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:21 PM
protein is good =too much is better, but yes back on topic

Larimar
04-04-2008, 07:22 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The point is, saying that vegetarians are weak and not getting enough protein and iron is a CHEAP shot that has no grounds of truth in it. There IS sufficient protein available in soy, eggs, tofu, nuts, cheese, AND veges (Beans for example, spinach for example). To say they are weak is a rude ignorant comment.
</div></div>

ok i take the weak comment back but say that to bodybuilders and see how far they get with tofu </div></div>
I didn't make that up. Theer are a lot of bodybuilders who are vegetarian. and too much protein isn't better- you don't use it. You poop an dpee it out..ok open a book :p lol. I'm done debating for real now


http://vegetarianbodybuilder.com/94.html

http://buildthatbody.blogspot.com/2007/10/vegetarian-bodybuilding-myths.html

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:24 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The point is, saying that vegetarians are weak and not getting enough protein and iron is a CHEAP shot that has no grounds of truth in it. There IS sufficient protein available in soy, eggs, tofu, nuts, cheese, AND veges (Beans for example, spinach for example). To say they are weak is a rude ignorant comment.
</div></div>

ok i take the weak comment back but say that to bodybuilders and see how far they get with tofu </div></div>
I didn't make that up. Theer are a lot of bodybuilders who are vegetarian. and too much protein isn't better- you don't use it. You poop an dpee it out..ok open a book :p lol. I'm done debating for real now


http://vegetarianbodybuilder.com/94.html

http://buildthatbody.blogspot.com/2007/10/vegetarian-bodybuilding-myths.html


</div></div>

:P

metal_gods
04-04-2008, 07:25 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you think this should be stopped or is it needed as some say?

Wach this as reported by Aljazeera (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czW8kdU7geM) </div></div>

no matter how many of them they kill .. there will be more of them next year

jaydee
04-04-2008, 07:27 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: metal_gods</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Do you think this should be stopped or is it needed as some say?

Wach this as reported by Aljazeera (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=czW8kdU7geM) </div></div>

no matter how many of them they kill .. there will be more of them next year </div></div>

whats the difference with this and canada geese beeing shot across the river omg

403_forbidden
04-04-2008, 07:30 PM
If you ban seal hunting or hunting in general up North how will the Inuit people get by that rely on Seal hunting for food, living, and survival?

Larimar
04-04-2008, 07:37 PM
Not many Inuits take part in the seal hunt, but I have no problems if they did. It would not be difficult to allow the Inuits to take part in hunting on their own land and to stop others from doing so.

sorry make that..there are no Inuits who take part in the commercial seal hunt at all..

"Not at all. There are no Inuit involved in the commercial seal hunt. In fact, the species of seal targeted during the hunt is known as the harp seal, and Inuit favour adult ring seals. "

-source; http://www.liberationbc.com/issues/seal_hunt#natives

riggs
04-04-2008, 08:35 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Riggs said....."I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments were truly trying to preserve our resources.They are trying to rebound our fish stocks through methods that are only eliminating a predator.The prey will rebound slightly but not to the healthy levels they would if we were serious about protecting their environment. "

but....

Canadian sealers, Canadian marine mammal biologists and the Canadian Government are world leaders in the field of resource utilization using scientific management principles combined with an educated workforce and a strict monitoring protocol to ensure the continued viability of sealing from both the economic and species perspectives. Canada is a world leader in the sustainable use of natural, renewable resources. </div></div>

Unfortunatley Canada is not the world which is why I said WORLD LEADERS.One country alone has no chance of stopping yet alone reverse the damage.Strengthening enviromental laws and penalties is the first and most painful step to slow the damage we're inflicting.If this was to happen tomorrow it would take decades for the process to come to a halt.In that time frame you would have industries threatening then leaving to operate in countries where the laws are more lax.Profits drive all industries no matter what Canada preaches.Profits are greater when they are allowed to pollute and that's the bottom line.So cudo's to Canada for it's great words but it stands behind the same economic principle that every other country follows,profit.

she
04-04-2008, 09:17 PM
""I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments""(riggs)

my point is... ""canada is a world leader""...hopefully the rest will follow our LEAD

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:25 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"canada is a world leader""...hopefully the rest will follow our LEAD </div></div>


If I remember right only 5 countries in the world "seal hunt" Canada being the biggest and killing more seals than any of the others ......so why should rest of the world follow us and start doing it too ?

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:27 PM
Macs, good point!
We shouldnt expect countries to follow a backwards practice.
Plus, most countries don't have much seals..and I think they'd get in trouble clubbing zoo animals :p

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:30 PM
i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:33 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species.

riggs
04-04-2008, 09:34 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">""I suppose it wouldn't bother me as much if I knew the world governments""(riggs)

my point is... ""canada is a world leader""...hopefully the rest will follow our LEAD

</div></div>

Even if Canada is a world leader (and I'll take your word on it)I believe the economic powers to be will always have the last say.In the eyes of industry, environmental concerns affect the bottom line.I believe this to be the same in all countries including Canada.

Even if Canada is a world leader in this area I believe it to be in the preach and not so much in the practice.

I sometimes wonder if it's too late to undo our doings.But I guess there's no need being concerned with out future when we can't control the present.

I hope other countries read from the chapters we have written on this and start to see the damage we are inflicting on the environment let alone our children.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:36 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals!

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

i've already proved that to be a false fact. lack of fsh has to do with human over fishing- maybe we should cull ppl:p lol jk

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:39 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals! </div></div>

True but do Canadian fishermen always have access to those places ..?

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:40 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

i've already proved that to be a false fact. lack of fsh has to do with human over fishing- maybe we should cull ppl:p lol jk </div></div>

YEAHHHH QUIT BLAMIN it on the seals!

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:41 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals! </div></div>

True but do Canadian fishermen always have access to those places ..?
</div></div>

im sure we already get different types of fish imported

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:42 PM
harp seals only eat a tiny portion of cod( what the fishermen want) the rest of the fish they eat are predators to the carp-and so harp seals HELP fishermen. Fish population is not the reason they kill seals..b.c killing seals will likely help the caarp predators survive and eat away the fish they want. They are [censored] with the balance of nature. A lot of fish we have now are bred on fish farms to be truthful..

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:45 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">harp seals only eat a tiny portion of cod( what the fishermen want) the rest of the fish they eat are predators to the carp-and so harp seals HELP fishermen. Fish population is not the reason they kill seals..b.c killing seals will likely help the caarp predators survive and eat away the fish they want. They are [censored] with the balance of nature. A lot of fish we have now are bred in farms to be truthful.. </div></div>

well seals must be here for some reason, for some purpose

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:46 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals! </div></div>

True but do Canadian fishermen always have access to those places ..?
</div></div>

im sure we already get different types of fish imported </div></div>


what's that got to do with anything? If we allow the seal population grow wildly soon there will be so many there won't be any food for them anymore and all the fish will be gone.
Look what has happened since they canceled spring bear hunt ....you got starving bears sitting in your patio looking for food. lol

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:47 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">harp seals only eat a tiny portion of cod( what the fishermen want) the rest of the fish they eat are predators to the carp-and so harp seals HELP fishermen. Fish population is not the reason they kill seals..b.c killing seals will likely help the caarp predators survive and eat away the fish they want. They are [censored] with the balance of nature. A lot of fish we have now are bred in farms to be truthful.. </div></div>

well seals must be here for some reason, for some purpose </div></div>

By They-I meant seal hunters.
Yes, the seals do have a purpose- to live.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:48 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">harp seals only eat a tiny portion of cod( what the fishermen want) the rest of the fish they eat are predators to the carp-and so harp seals HELP fishermen. Fish population is not the reason they kill seals..b.c killing seals will likely help the caarp predators survive and eat away the fish they want. They are [censored] with the balance of nature. A lot of fish we have now are bred in farms to be truthful.. </div></div>

well seals must be here for some reason, for some purpose </div></div>

No, I stated that seal hunters are scr-weing with the balance of nat. Not Seals. Each animal has a purpose, yes. </div></div>

so..... as usual its the ppls fault. pollution and wrecking the atmosphere is ppls fault, killing and hunting down animals is ppls fault too then, always stems to ppls fault

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:49 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals! </div></div>

True but do Canadian fishermen always have access to those places ..?
</div></div>

im sure we already get different types of fish imported </div></div>


what's that got to do with anything? If we allow the seal population grow wildly soon there will be so many there won't be any food for them anymore and all the fish will be gone.
Look what has happened since they canceled spring bear hunt ....you got starving bears sitting in your patio looking for food. lol </div></div>

so what thats cool and plus its better to keep them alive. what gives us the right to kill them off? besides i never saw a bear loose in the city once

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:49 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">i think they just do it for the fun of it, which is sick and wrong leave them alone, seals dont do any harm </div></div>

You need to control the seal population or there will be no fish left. Seals aren't endangered species. </div></div>

theres plenty of fish in the salt water and oeans where there isnt even any seals! </div></div>

True but do Canadian fishermen always have access to those places ..?
</div></div>

im sure we already get different types of fish imported </div></div>


what's that got to do with anything? If we allow the seal population grow wildly soon there will be so many there won't be any food for them anymore and all the fish will be gone.
Look what has happened since they canceled spring bear hunt ....you got starving bears sitting in your patio looking for food. lol </div></div>

The seals aren't in any danger of eating all the fish. They don't eat just one type of fish. There's no reason to believe they will starve. They are also naturally killed by the ice melting, sharks, bears, and other predators. There's no reason to hunt them for any population reasons. There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry.

riggs
04-04-2008, 09:51 PM
[quote=RedRose There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. [/quote]

Now that's funny..... /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:53 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:54 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

bottom line is what gives us the right to kill them fof to balance the food chain?? whaa? just like unnecessary hunting ,theres no need for it

Macs II
04-04-2008, 09:55 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

bottom line is what gives us the right to kill them fof to balance the food chain?? whaa? just like unnecessary hunting ,theres no need for it </div></div>

but it's ok to have slaughter houses so you can have your burger ?

Larimar
04-04-2008, 09:56 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

lol fine, I'll make signs that say "Don't Feed the Seals"

jaydee
04-04-2008, 09:59 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

bottom line is what gives us the right to kill them fof to balance the food chain?? whaa? just like unnecessary hunting ,theres no need for it </div></div>

but it's ok to have slaughter houses so you can have your burger ? </div></div>

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/rofl.gif dats true i dont agree wit dat eitehr but meh what ya gonna do?? i just dont understand where they draw the lines on what and what they cant kill. i can see pigs for suasage and beef for hamburgers, but seals doesnt relate to food lol

she
04-04-2008, 10:32 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"canada is a world leader""...hopefully the rest will follow our LEAD </div></div>


If I remember right only 5 countries in the world "seal hunt" Canada being the biggest and killing more seals than any of the others ......so why should rest of the world follow us and start doing it too ? </div></div>

Canada has a strict monitoring protocol to ensure the continued viability of sealing from both the economic and species perspectives.

Thats where others should take our lead. Sorry if you didnt understand.

jaydee
04-04-2008, 10:34 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">"canada is a world leader""...hopefully the rest will follow our LEAD </div></div>


If I remember right only 5 countries in the world "seal hunt" Canada being the biggest and killing more seals than any of the others ......so why should rest of the world follow us and start doing it too ? </div></div>

Canada has a strict monitoring protocol to ensure the continued viability of sealing from both the economic and species perspectives.

Thats where others should take our lead. Sorry if you didnt understand. </div></div>

obvioulsy there not doing much cause its still happening

she
04-04-2008, 11:10 PM
CANADIAN SEAL HUNT
MYTHS AND REALITIES

http://www.dfo-mpo.gc.ca/seal-phoque/myth_e.htm

a good informative read

jaydee
04-04-2008, 11:13 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">There's no danger of a seal being at your door hungry. </div></div>

How do you know that ? the day there is one I will blame you for it /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif </div></div>

i think it would be cool to have a bear at your doorstep... id throw it a fish

Larimar
04-04-2008, 11:17 PM
lol, yes..b.c fisheries and Canada website don't have any motive to show bias :p

The vid I showed of the seals left after being clubbed were clearly alive-even struggling getting out of the water until on land. It was definitely NOT a reflex but a deliberate action to survive. Just because an animal has a reflex upon death doesn't mean that people are killing them correctly. I could go on about each so called Myth on that site. It's a joke.

she
04-04-2008, 11:32 PM
The sad reality is that we live in an urban world where Bambi syndrome has permeated city dwellers' consciousness.

Urban people do not make the connection between the food they eat and the killing that produces that food. They are not used to seeing the killing that leads to the neatly packaged and plastic wrapped food they eat, or to the jackets, pants, hats, shoes, belts, purses and briefcases they wear or carry.

Therefore they can, understandably, become upset when exposed to the production side of these products.

Animal rights fanatics understand this and use Bambi syndrome as a tactic to further the goal of ending man's use of animals. Sealing is the perfect vehicle for them because it is bloody, takes place in the open air in a beautiful environment - and the animals are wrongly seen to be cute and cuddly!

she
04-04-2008, 11:33 PM
Oh...and so you know...I personally am against sealing.

Larimar
04-04-2008, 11:38 PM
I also have more intelligence than to be against something b.c of this "Bambi" syndrom you cooked up.
I would be just as passionate to stop the slaughter of thousands of baboons if they were doing that-and I don't particularily find them cuddly-but aggressive and ugly. I think a cow has every right to live, and I think that the slaughter of an animal for the purpose of "wealth" and "greed"-which the seal hunt is clearly about is not only unnecessary but something I hope humans in the future look back on with shame!
Hopefully 100 years down the road they won't have children asking what a seal is.
We used to hunt wolves as well, for a lot of the same reasons. We almost hunted them out of extinsion at one point long ago-which is why when they nee dto control th epopulation many acts such as birthcontrol and relocation are being done.
BTW, all our tax dollars apparently do into helping this seal hunt which I think is appaling.

I could care less what a seal looks like, the fact is- the purpose of the slaughter is not needed-the so called facts don't hold up and there's no need to make them suffer.
I don't eat chicken,s cows, or fish so no, i am not worried about being involved in some cute factor.
Telling people they only care, b.c something is cute-jumps leaps and bounds to assumptions that again-is a made up "fact"
It's hard to argue against things that have no basis for being true tho. It also insults people's intelligence and ability to come to conclusions on their own based on their own morals.
It's really easy for people to sidestep a real issue by making claims that ppl only care b.c it's cute. That really takes away from the real issue.
Trying to make animal rights groups sound bad by calling them fanatics, or tree huggers, or whatever is also a cheap way for people to sidestep real issues. If they can't find a real reason that people are wrong to be against seal hunts-they say "why not call em fanatic or just accuse them of thinking the animals are cute..then we don't have to come up with REAL reasons to counter their facts and opinions with", /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif



but on another note- why would a seal be wrongfully cute?
That doesn't make sense. Is it wrong to think a dog's cute while your in china-since it is food afterall...



Alright- If people read my past posts they'll notice I countered most if not all reason sto hunt seals so I no longer shall be postin here. cheers peeps

jaydee
04-05-2008, 01:51 PM
i dont think you'll be seeing Macs eating blubber any time soon /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/whistle.gif

bohd
04-05-2008, 08:30 PM
right or wrong will always be the question....more often than not humans get more emotional about animals than what is happening to people in other parts of the world....i disagree in the seal hunt in that the seal skins are used for fashion and not warmth as the inuits did.. i am not sure how much of the meat is utilized but for my mind, it should ALL be utilized. i have eaten seal meat and it is all right,,,,a bit to getting used to but palatable. as to the method of harvesting these seals...IF done properly, that is a strategically placed blow to the head....painless..death is never pretty, no matter how its done but commercial slaughterhouses are far worse and anybody eating meat and criticizing the seal harvest are hypocrits.
and...i do hunt, but i would never consider hunting as a 'SPORT'and anybody who thinks killing something is a sport had better think again....i harvest some animals because i know exactly where and how they have lived...i do my own killing, processing of these animals and am VERY thankful for the nurishment they provide.

jaydee
04-05-2008, 08:54 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bohd</div><div class="ubbcode-body">right or wrong will always be the question....more often than not humans get more emotional about animals than what is happening to people in other parts of the world....i disagree in the seal hunt in that the seal skins are used for fashion and not warmth as the inuits did.. i am not sure how much of the meat is utilized but for my mind, it should ALL be utilized. i have eaten seal meat and it is all right,,,,a bit to getting used to but palatable. as to the method of harvesting these seals...IF done properly, that is a strategically placed blow to the head....painless..death is never pretty, no matter how its done but commercial slaughterhouses are far worse and anybody eating meat and criticizing the seal harvest are hypocrits.
and...i do hunt, but i would never consider hunting as a 'SPORT'and anybody who thinks killing something is a sport had better think again....i harvest some animals because i know exactly where and how they have lived...i do my own killing, processing of these animals and am VERY thankful for the nurishment they provide. </div></div>

i eat chicken, beef, pork, steaks but i am still against the seal hunt cause its barbaric and unnecessary. i dont eat seal and seal isnt a common food for humans really like the latter ones i just mentioned. seal hunting is unnecessary, but we have to get protiein from somehwere donr we?

C3PO
04-05-2008, 09:49 PM
The problem is we have to much time on our hands and we're sitting around on our fat asses trying to find a cause.
Do you think starving people would give a rat's [censored] about the seal hunt if it meant food for them? It's really all about perspective. What i'd like to see is (and i really mean this) is for those of you who are against the slaughter of animals for food or clothing, to be starving (I mean really starving) and have the choice to club that baby seal or starve to death yourself. Now probably you'll say I'd starve to death but your only outright lying. you'd beat that little f*kkers head in and enjoy a nice big blubber burger.....

kitca
04-05-2008, 09:56 PM
c3po, the seal hunt isnt about food it is about the 'fashion' industry.

C3PO
04-05-2008, 09:58 PM
It's about harvesting an animal for economic purposes.

Larimar
04-05-2008, 10:07 PM
That's a ridicuous statement considering people have been known to eat eachother when starving as well, it doesn't make it "okay" to kill people though, and extreem cases that may never happen do not prove any points. Obviously people can and have lived off the land and those that do are not doing so for "commercial" or needless reasons.
the seal hunt does NOT mean food for the starving, and if it did perhaps there would be no cause to fight against. Realistically all that grain we are feeding to cows could be used for starving children as well, but we don't.
I'm far from a person who sits on my [censored] all day-which I'd like to point out is rather average in size. I do what I can where I can, and voicing an opinion is educational and benificial.
it is like the time I raised money for African children, a woman walked up to me, sneered, and said why am I not raising money for starving homeless ppl here ?
There's no pleasing some ppl. (besides, can I not do both at different times..plus, we are all only one person so we can't choose every benifit to help).
Yes, there's other causes, there always will be-but we get to choose where to place our hearts and nobody is less deserving just b.c it isn't as important to someone else.
i believe animals are important, if anyone has a problem with that they can deal with it on their own.
It's a pretty big assumption to say that someone would kill to survive if they are morally against it. There are whole cultures in India who lived thousands of years believing animals have souls and shouldnt be killed for food-and they do not, no matter how hot, dry, or hungry they are. Some people may stoop to being immoral, but not everyone is that weak. Fact is, there's plenty th eEarth gives us that doesn't have a face and is quite tasty.
Living off a land of plenty is easy, and for those who don't eat animals it would be the same as placing them in location without any food. They would not see the animal as a meal anymore than they would see dirt and rocks as one. It would be a sentence of death. Clearly it is not needed to place ourselves in that situation, though many people are-The easiest and most healthy thing to feed them though is grains/rice-not meat.

That being said, the statements are still ridiculous b.c they are all "what if" scenerios" and not at all related to the reality that none of the seals hunted are killed for a GOOD reason-only for the profit of the wealthy and for the fun of the sport. I've already stated the reasons why I believe that to be true-and I won't go into it again.
As far as assuming ppl have too much time on their hands, again a ridiculous assumption-those that voice moral choices are more than likely out there fighting the good fight, not people who don't care.

C3PO
04-05-2008, 10:23 PM
I applaud your moral convictions and your stance.

My statements were not ridiculous, however, as you pointed out they are hypothetical in nature.

I'd still bet $1 you'd be gorging on that blubber burger...

The only reason you care about baby seals is because you have the time to be. If your daily life consisted of surviving like so many millions of other people who are not as blessed as we, you wouldn't give a rat's [censored] about baby seals. So, my point is, it's just a matter of perspective, and it can't be a 'moral' judgement.

Larimar
04-05-2008, 10:43 PM
Atually, no I wouldn't eat meat in that "hypthetical" scenerio-I'd struggle to find other means of food. It can be done.
Is it a bad thing to be in a place in life where we CAN care? Are you saying we should not not care about the world around us?
What is it you are trying to get across? That if you are starving you don't care about the world around you and those that are in a state to help shouldn't b.c they don't know what they'd do in a "hypothetical situation"? It's a circular statement taht gets ppl nowhere.
Of course you wouldnt care about seals if you were starving in pain you ALSO wouldnt give a crap about the man dying beside you-doesn't mean we should too.
I already told you there are cultures that won't kill to survive..You won't accept this. They are a religious group called Sikh's and in India they do not all live wealthy lives-MOST ppl in India are dirt poor.
You won't see them killing an animal.
Just because there are starving people in another country should mean those that aren't shouldnt care about animals? Again, can't you see that's an unfair reasoning? I can't care about humans AND animals while I live my life? I can't help both? I can't be appauld by cruelty to children AND non humans?
I can't say abuse of children is wrong and the slaughter of seals is wrong?
There's no perspective of that seal hunt used for GOOD. If it were, that's another story altogether. Nobody(in their right mind) pickets causes that are used to help ppl for the highest good-highest good is not commercialized wealth and greed at the cost of animal and human life).
If the seals are used by people struggling to survive I wouldnt be against it!-I WOULD NOT do it myself (and if you knew me, you'd know this was no lie-it's my spiritual belief) but I would not think it be evil if done by a starving family. The fact is and the reality is- that seals aren't be hunted for any GOOD or moral reason. It should be a shut down operation-Human lives are being lost because of it as well, it is a needless death.So yah, I think puppymills, factory farms(b.c I'd love to kill two birds with one stone-take the money used to feed those animals and give the grains to the starving and save the animals life), and seal hunts should be stopped just as much as I think ppl should be fed and chidlren should be loved(just my opinion). Just b.c there are other causes out there involving human kind it doesnt mean that we should turn a blind eye to the rest of the worlds problems.




So please understand that nobody is saying that struggling people shouldnt eat. Inuit's do eat seal-and not Harp seal-and I have nothing against that. But when killing is done for the wrong reasons there is a purpose to standing up and saying so.
I won't close my eyes just b.c there are ppl less fortunate then I am. It is b.c of my fortunate lifestyl that I am able to help many different causes and I chose to do so.
I hope you do too-no matter what that cause is.

Larimar
04-05-2008, 10:59 PM
ps a "fortunate" lifestyle is also a "perspective " thing. Maybe I and others who want to stop the seal hunt have money but are beatin everyday by a club-I'm not..., but to assume someone has an easy life is..well, you know.
Many people here suffer I think in their own ways.
I won't judge them.
I only state my opinion that I think the seal hunt is wrong-I also don't judge those who do it. That doesn't mean though, that I think it shouldn't change.
I'm sure many females who fought for the right to vote did not feel their supressors were evil, but they knew it was wrong and fought for a change.
There's plenty of thing son this Earth to change still-so i Hope nobody ever stops fighting or voicing their opinion.

It's also true I could ask you if you think th eslaughter of human children is wrong-and it is done placees. I could then just use your reasoning and say well, you wouldnt feel that way, and I bet you 1 dollar you'd eat your baby if you were starving and didn't want to die. That's an unfair arguement though now isn't it? It wouldn't change the fact that slaughtering babies is wrong now would it? I certianly understand your perspective, and despite what it may look like I do respect your views.

C3PO
04-07-2008, 04:43 PM
Harvesting of animals is just a perspective. That's my point.
Your comparisons of women-voting and slaughter of children are absurd.

However, that doesn't mean we should turn a blind eye to the 'illegal' activites surrounding animals. I speak of the over-harvesting of certain species. We do need laws and regulations surrounding this. But thats why we need laws in all apsects of human civilization. There are unscrupulous people who basically are greedy and will cheat the rules for their own selfish purposes. Killing of seals for their hide and oils is not wrong in my opinion. It's basically the same as fishing, crabbing, meat processors, chicken farms. We need animals for the food chain, for clothing, for economic benefits, for the good of the human population. You want to be a vegetarian and wear organic clothes, be my guest, but use your time and energies for the good of your fellow human beings....Walk thru a homeless shelter, walk thru a children's cancer ward, walk thru an orphanage...these are better 'causes' than some seal you'll never meet...(who probably just got ate by a shark).

she
04-07-2008, 04:54 PM
So what is the difference between animal welfare and animal rights? For those of you who think there isn't much difference, you will be shocked. A difference which anyone who contributes money to helping animals should definitely understand. Animal welfare is an ideal that has been around for over one hundred years. An ideal that decrees it is our responsibility as human beings to provide animals with the proper housing, nutrition, treatment, protection and humane euthanasia when necessary. For hunting and harvesting this would include responsible management to ensure conservation and humane harvesting techniques. Animal rights sprouted in the 1960's and believes that human beings are equal to all other animals. Basically, when you catch a mouse in a trap it's the same as crushing your child's skull. They believe no animal should be used by humans for any purpose such as companionship, farming, transportation, food, assistance, etc. While animal welfare advocates work toward enriching the bond between humans and other animals, animal rights advocates work toward driving a permanent wedge between the two.
Ingrid Newkirk, founder of People for the Ethical Treatment of Animals (PETA) said,
"There is no rational basis for saying that a human being has special rights. A rat is a pig is a dog is a boy. They're all mammals."

she
04-07-2008, 05:00 PM
"It doesn't matter what is true; it only matters what people believe is true"
Paul Watson, 1993
For the last 30 years animal rights groups have been using the anti-sealing industry as a cash cow. If you wish to refute this then do the research yourself but you will find the same thing I have, the fastest growing sector of the sealing industry is and has been the protest sector. Greenpeace basically went from rags to riches due to the amount of money they earned through fighting the seal hunt. Money that totals to more than contributions for any other campaign. The International Federation for Animal Welfare(IFAW) went from nothing to presently bringing in close to $100 million a year, all on the back of the seal hunt. Groups like Sea Shepherd Conservation Society(SSCS) and the Humane Society of the United States(HSUS) look to the seal hunt to jam their coffers year after year. In 2004, then president and CEO of the HSUS, Paul Erwin was paid $510,680 which was up from his salary of the previous year, $315,898. Nice raise. In 2004, the CEO of the IFAW, Fred O'Regan was paid $250,218. In 2001, Paul Watson, President and CEO of SSCS was paid $40,000. This is modest in comparison to the others but lets keep it in perspective, SSCS is but a pimple to the festering boil of the others and Watson had once said,

"I will never accept a single dollar for myself from charitable donations."
I know, these are old figures and I can only imagine what they are paying themselves now seeing that all three organizations, with emphasis on the IFAW and HSUS, have been growing in leaps and bounds every year. To think, in large part, they owe it all to the seal hunt, do they really want it to end? It is no wonder they put so much emphasis on the harp seal which is not and never has been close to being endangered when there are presently six other species of seal which hover on the brink of extinction.
TheSealFishery.com.

C3PO
04-07-2008, 05:06 PM
While children starve to death....

Barry Morris
04-07-2008, 05:14 PM
...harp seals are cuter.

GenX
04-07-2008, 05:19 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">...harp seals are cuter. </div></div>

Especially when beat to death, all under the blessings of government.

jwarner-smith
04-07-2008, 05:38 PM
Here's the truth for all of you gullible idiots who think anything good of Paul Watson. Paul Watson is the biggest con artist on the planet (right behind Al Gore that is) and he has made more money off his "opposition" to the seal hunt than anything else he's done.

If you want to say anything about the seal hunt, then you have to argue against every kind of animal harvesting from your fishing trip to your week in the bush to get your moose.

You want to talk about suffering, how about that fish suffocating to death in the bottom of your boat while you have another beer. That's far more horrendous and causes far more suffering than getting clubbed in the head.

GenX
04-07-2008, 05:45 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Paul Watson is the biggest con artist on the planet (right behind Al Gore that is) </div></div>

/ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/purpbanana.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/high5.gif /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/beerchug.gif

http://www.awesomebackgrounds.com/templates/as-fireworks-anim-1.GIF

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:06 PM
It's funny, I try to make a point that ridiculous hypothetical stories were absurd, by making an absurd statement-and it's called absurd-Talk about going over ppls heads! It's so freakin funny how my points drift over the heads of those who are uneducated on animal cruelty and exploitation. Using animals-seals, whales, etc for oil isn't GOOD.
FYI I DO help human kind, probably more so than the ppl telling me to. I'm done arguing here, b.c everything I say isn't read or understood. Shame, but true.
Telling people not to care about what's wrong to animals b.c there's ppl worse off, is ignorant. We are capable of caring for BOTH, not ONE OR THE OTHER. I love helping people and I hope the people who boast about it, are taking action as well. Stopping the seal hunt would SAVE lives!! Human ones! Or do you not watch the news?
I'm done here(replying to false facts) b.c ppl prove to be ignorant and not at all making legit points or using facts. They make things up-That's the sad part. Go on believing the seal hunts a great thing- while those family's mourn the loss of those that drown doing so. I'll continue replying to only those who make sense or use arguements that aren't strawman arguements

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 06:12 PM
RedRose I agree 100% with you...animals and just as important as us humans are...all on earth is equal not just one or the other!

GenX
04-07-2008, 06:14 PM
http://www.t-arty.com/images/designssmall/iclubseals.jpg

GenX
04-07-2008, 06:15 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">RedRose I agree 100% with you...animals and just as important as us humans are...all on earth is equal not just one or the other! </div></div>

"Just as important"?

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:17 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">RedRose I agree 100% with you...animals and just as important as us humans are...all on earth is equal not just one or the other! </div></div>
thankyou, we kill the animals..we kill ourselves eventually.
We don't take care of this Earth, it's bad news. Killing animals without having a good reason, is going to cost us. It does already! we pay through our tax dollars. If people cared so much for starving children they would take that tax money and buy grains for them! not spend it on seal hunts. But obviously they can't se how stopping the seal hunt benifits human kind. It's a waste of money.
Sorry , but I will only reply to others now, not the ppl who are giving me ridiculous arguements that are made up.

GenX
04-07-2008, 06:18 PM
I agree seal hunts are very sad, extremely cruel, and there has to be a better way.

But I draw the line at equating animals with humans.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:21 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I agree seal hunts are very sad, extremely cruel, and there has to be a better way.

But I draw the line at equating animals with humans. </div></div>


Animals and humans suffer equally. The only difference is we make our species more important b.c we are that species-It's biologically fine to do so. Even Elephants take their own species as most important. They will stop and only grieve for the deceast elephants, not other species. They clearly do feel emotions-They hug the bones and cry...but not for other animals...So it is of course, natural to believe we are the most important-and we should think that way. Humans come first b.c we are human. Doesn't mean we cannot acknowledge that all animals suffer the same amount of pain - humans are too classified animals.

Here, I found the quotes on elephants. May be interesting to some ppl.

"When an elephant dies in the wild, the other members of the herd will stand over the corpse for days mourning. In one case over a hundred elephants stood vigil over a dead elephant. One of them tried to pick it up and stand it on its feet nearly sixty times before eventually giving up. Sometimes they will cover the body with leaves and branches Eventually with visible sings of distress they will leave the corpse but they often return over the following days to pay their respects.

One female elephant was observed leaving the herd and walking thirty miles to visit the bones of a recently departed mate.

Whenever elephants pass the place where another elpehenat died they will stop and stand in silence for a long periods. They might pick up the bones affectionately and hug them as if mourning the loss.

A female elephant watched her cage mate die while giving birth to a stillborn calf. She stood stock still for a long time until her legs eventually gave way. For three weeks she lay in one spot with her trunk curled up, her ears drooping and her eyes moist. No matter how hard they tried, her keepers could not persuade her to eat. They watched her slowly starve herself to death. "


So of course, we all feel pain..we all also have to keep our own species as most important.

jwarner-smith
04-07-2008, 06:22 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">RedRose I agree 100% with you...animals and just as important as us humans are...all on earth is equal not just one or the other! </div></div>
thankyou, we kill the animals..we kill ourselves eventually.
We don't take care of this Earth, it's bad news. Killing animals without having a good reason, is going to cost us. It does already! we pay through our tax dollars. If people cared so much for starving children they would take that tax money and buy grains for them! not spend it on seal hunts. But obviously they can't se how stopping the seal hunt benifits human kind. It's a waste of money.
Sorry , but I will only reply to others now, not the ppl who are giving me ridiculous arguements that are made up. </div></div>

OH MY GAWD!!! What moronic CRAP!!! Red Rose, I thought you were leaving. Don't let the door hit your BUTT on the way out and Aussie, you're obviously a godless heathen, otherwise you would know that God gave us dominion over all the creatures of the earth.

We are not equal with the seals. WE EAT SEALS!

GenX
04-07-2008, 06:33 PM
Red Rose, that's one way of seeing humans as superior to animals.

Then of course for the religious, there is the fact God gave us dominion over all creation.

But I think, irregardless of the religious or biological factor, a case can be made of human superiority to other animals.

When was the last time a Kangaroo vet treated a wounded child?

When was the last time a mongoose invented a vaccine for polio?

How many charities ran by elephants and rhinos provide aid for ailing giraffes?

Now, saying we are superior does not equate to saying we can run roughshod over other creatures. Because of superiority, we owe it to other animals to treat them fair and humane.

However, it goes too far to say we are "equals".

Strife
04-07-2008, 06:40 PM
Let me ask this question. Nobody weeps for the antelope or other animals when a lion kills them for food so why is there so much importance on the killing of seals. Its not like they are killed for no good reason. The seals provide food for the people that kill them and their skin provides monies to buy other products. The government regulates on how many can be killed to ensure that the species survive. Ultimately, we are on top of the food chain.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:43 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Red Rose, that's one way of seeing humans as superior to animals.

Then of course for the religious, there is the fact God gave us dominion over all creation.

But I think, irregardless of the religious or biological factor, a case can be made of human superiority to other animals.

When was the last time a Kangaroo vet treated a wounded child?

When was the last time a mongoose invented a vaccine for polio?

How many charities ran by elephants and rhinos provide aid for ailing giraffes?

Now, saying we are superior does not equate to saying we can run roughshod over other creatures. Because of superiority, we owe it to other animals to treat them fair and humane.

However, it goes too far to say we are "equals". </div></div>


In your beliefs then, b.c a disabled person may not be at the level to function as said "superior" human with a functioning brain or body-they are not equal in the fact that they can suffer and feel pain.(I don't really think you feel that way) That's all I'm saying, is that we are all equal to feeling pain and that we should not abuse our ability to think, reason, and behave over them. It was at one point believed kids with autism did not feel pain-so they were never drugged b4 stitched up or operated on! Incredible isn't it? We know now that we are all equal in pain and suffering-just not equal in the ability to express that pain. Understand what I'm saying? Animals equally feel pain, even if they are not equal in intelligence.**************


I think we are here to take care of th eEarth and not to abuse it. I have never said I was against using animals for survival, but there comes a time we must ask ourselves if that is truly what we are doing.
I am not religious-and if I were there'd be more than just Christianity to choose from. Not all believe animals are for our amusement. i also would care to wonder if God seriously wanted animals for our killing. He did give us dominion-in Genesis right? In teh garden of Eden? There were no animals consumed until they were kicked out of Eden b.c of Sin. Is it not a fair assumption to wonder if the start of animal and humans eating flesh came about b.c peace was destroyed? Did it truly have anything to do with God wanting us dominion over them?
Or did he mean for us to look over them. I'm not looking for a religious debate-b.c Christianity is not my religion. Just trying to show a different view.

We obviously have intelligence that animals don't have, we also are stupid when it comes to the abilities that some animals have as well. There are things animals can do that humans cannot. The memory of some animals far exceeds our own memory for example.
We were not always using reason to create technology-through out evolution we were similar to the Bonobo ape..I mean, is there really a reason to make another creature suffer b.c we evolved to create a building?
If anything our ability to use reason should give us our compassion as well.
So, I'm not disagreeing with you-people are superior...BUT we have to know that with emotions and pain we all have bodies...it's equal.
Again, not looking to start a religious debate.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:45 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Canadian13</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Let me ask this question. Nobody weeps for the antelope or other animals when a lion kills them for food so why is there so much importance on the killing of seals. Its not like they are killed for no good reason. The seals provide food for the people that kill them and their skin provides monies to buy other products. The government regulates on how many can be killed to ensure that the species survive. Ultimately, we are on top of the food chain. </div></div>

When an animal kills it's b.c it's in their instinct to do so for the survival of their species. If you read through the thread you'll find I've already countered all reasons to seal hunt. It is not helpful to the survival of our species, it caters to the already wealthy people. The fishermen are better to make money fishing shellfish-not by risking their lives by walking on the ice. Many have already drowned. It's not safe, and it's not benificial. Without it, our species would be fine. Wild animals and humans living off the land have reason. Lions do not kill more than they eat, and the meat never ends up in the garbage.
Of course, I don't like to watch it-i would wince and hide my eyes..but they do not abuse the ability to kill.

Strife
04-07-2008, 06:50 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When an animal kills it's b.c it's in their instinct to do so for the survival of their species.</div></div>

Okay....have you ever lived like one of the people who do this for a living. I'm not talking fishermen. I am talking about Inuit people. People that live in sub-freezing temperatures all year round and many dont have the pleasure of experiencing all 4 seasons. To many of these people, seal hunting is a way of life. They kill to survive.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 06:52 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Canadian13</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body">When an animal kills it's b.c it's in their instinct to do so for the survival of their species.</div></div>

Okay....have you ever lived like one of the people who do this for a living. I'm not talking fishermen. I am talking about Inuit people. People that live in sub-freezing temperatures all year round and many dont have the pleasure of experiencing all 4 seasons. To many of these people, seal hunting is a way of life. They kill to survive. </div></div>
If you read my posts I have stated i'm not against Inuit's hunting for food. In actualityThey don't even hunt Harp seals, they hunt a seperate species of seal. I'm not against hunting for survival. I'm against the mass slaughter of seals by Non Inuit people for the sake of the wealthy. I wouldn't eat seal myself, I'm a vegetarian-but this belief is subject to "me" only and I'm not an extremist by any means. I don't frown on Inuit's living, anymore than I frowned on their behaviour to throw babies off the cliffs into the water for their survival as well(in the past).
I wouldn't do a lot of it Myself, but I can have compassion for their situation and I don't judge the actions they've had to do.
I do think it's good when people progress and learn new ways to survive-as they've done with the babies.

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 07:04 PM
Those people do not just kill them for food...clear fact watch the document on it!!! They kill big for the money...not just for eating. Get your facts straight and I do not think God would have allowed people going around killing everything even animals for money!!!

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:05 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Those people do not just kill them for food...clear fact watch the document on it!!! They kill big for the money...not just for eating. Get your facts straight and I do not think God would have allowed people going around killing everything even animals for money!!! </div></div>
mhmm..Isn't greed like, one of the deadly sins /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 07:09 PM
Yes tell me about it!!! Ok killing to eat is totally different then killing to put cash in your wallet...do you see all the animals runnimg around with leather wallets in their fur killing other to fill it??? NO I do not think so..us as humans do aweful things for the sake of money when our kids grow up there will be so many animals gone never to be seen in wild again thanks to our greed...God wake up and get a heart and a life!!!

kitca
04-07-2008, 07:13 PM
redrose, you are very well spoken and i agree with everything you are saying.

i think some folks on here have nothing better to do than just argue and get someone rilled (sp?) up for fun. they are not reading the posts because if they were they would be able to understand what you have written, it makes perfect sense, whether you agree or not.

Nihilistic Heathen
04-07-2008, 07:19 PM
The WWF claims that seal hunting is done humanely and many other independent veterinary organisations. The only organisations making the claim that it isn't, are making millions of dollars by making those claims.

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 07:20 PM
Yes I very much agree kitca people on bbs love to argue anything and half the time do not even know what it is really about that they read in the postings. If you wish to argue all day long go to anger management do not come onto postings and stir up crap all the time there is no need to fight peoples own personal opinions if you wish to do so take it else where!

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:21 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: kitca</div><div class="ubbcode-body">redrose, you are very well spoken and i agree with everything you are saying.

i think some folks on here have nothing better to do than just argue and get someone rilled (sp?) up for fun. they are not reading the posts because if they were they would be able to understand what you have written, it makes perfect sense, whether you agree or not. </div></div>
Thankyou Kitca, I also agree. Some people are looking for a fight instead of just discussing an issue. It's ashame mature discussions go down the drain here. I never have a problem admitting an opposing side has a valid point on other boards where debates are not seen as outlets for anger.

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 07:22 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nihilistic Heathen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The WWF claims that seal hunting is done humanely and many other independent veterinary organisations. The only organisations making the claim that it isn't, are making millions of dollars by making those claims.</div></div>
Yes in most cases it is done for food but now days alot is done for the sake of getting money those people that slaughter them and tear open their guts while they are still alive even admit to it!!! When my kids grow up I want them to enjoy all the animals we enjoy seeing today not just read about them in some paper somewhere like we do with the all the other animals that are now extinct.

kitca
04-07-2008, 07:27 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Nihilistic Heathen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The WWF claims that seal hunting is done humanely and many other independent veterinary organisations. The only organisations making the claim that it isn't, are making millions of dollars by making those claims.</div></div>
Yes in most cases it is done for food but now days alot is done for the sake of getting money those people that slaughter them and tear open their guts while they are still alive even admit to it!!! When my kids grow up I want them to enjoy all the animals we enjoy seeing today not just read about them in some paper somewhere like we do with the all the other animals that are now extinct. </div></div>

yes i agree!!! what kind of world are we giving to our kids?

Stingray
04-07-2008, 07:34 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?
</div></div>Excellent argument she. This is very true. Also, Native Americans and Inuits were much healthier than the Europeans before they settled in North America. Their diets consisted of wild plants, fruits, vegetables, meats and fish including the seal. If someone can think of a better way where these people in the north can have a better diet than what they have now and a better way to provide income for their families, step up to the plate. I'm sure their all ears. Until you've actually been up there and truly know what it's like living and growing up in that part of the world, everyone should think twice about seal hunting. They probably think our way of life if pathetic. They don't have all of our luxuries that we take for granted here. They don't have grocery stores where everything is imported, they don't have a steel plant where they can go to work every day. If they do have grocery and supply stores up there, do you have any idea what it costs them for food and groceries? They've been doing this for thousands of years, how can anyone tell them that what they are doing is wrong. It's like them telling us that our way of life is wrong. The steel plant harms our earth way more than they do...

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 07:38 PM
I am very sure the gov could find better ways if they do not want all our animals to go and never to be seen again by our children when they grow up. Years ago the natives only killed for the meat to eat not for money like today that is not a traditional way.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?
</div></div>Excellent argument she. This is very true. Also, Native Americans and Inuits were much healthier than the Europeans before they settled in North America. Their diets consisted of wild plants, fruits, vegetables, meats and fish including the seal. If someone can think of a better way where these people in the north can have a better diet than what they have now and a better way to provide income for their families, step up to the plate. I'm sure their all ears. Until you've actually been up there and truly know what it's like living and growing up in that part of the world, everyone should think twice about seal hunting. They probably think our way of life if pathetic. They don't have all of our luxuries that we take for granted here. They don't have grocery stores where everything is imported, they don't have a steel plant where they can go to work every day. If they do have grocery and supply stores up there, do you have any idea what it costs them for food and groceries? </div></div>

I'm sorry, but you are talking about a seperate subject. Nobody is against people living and eating off their own land. btw, It should be noted with all due respect, that Inuit's used to die early, of disease caused by bad meat. Their body's were not at all healthy and most died young. This is why they killed most of their babies. They could not afford to add to the population when they didn't have enough to eat themselves. They did not live long and healthy lives until we imported their food. Native Americans/Aboriginals, were indeed healthy. inuit's now get food shipped to them and they shop like every other Westerner. That is why their health and livelyhood has increased. bt again, nobody is saying hunting for survival is wrong. We are talking about the seal hunt that is commercialized. Two totally seperate subjects. Inuit people do not take part in the hunt b.c they do not eat Harp seals.

Stingray
04-07-2008, 07:40 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?
</div></div>Excellent argument she. This is very true. Also, Native Americans and Inuits were much healthier than the Europeans before they settled in North America. Their diets consisted of wild plants, fruits, vegetables, meats and fish including the seal. If someone can think of a better way where these people in the north can have a better diet than what they have now and a better way to provide income for their families, step up to the plate. I'm sure their all ears. Until you've actually been up there and truly know what it's like living and growing up in that part of the world, everyone should think twice about seal hunting. They probably think our way of life if pathetic. They don't have all of our luxuries that we take for granted here. They don't have grocery stores where everything is imported, they don't have a steel plant where they can go to work every day. If they do have grocery and supply stores up there, do you have any idea what it costs them for food and groceries? </div></div>

I'm sorry, but you are talking about a seperate subject. Nobody is against people living and eating off their own land. btw, It should be noted with all due respect, that Inuit's used to die early, of disease caused by bad meat. Their body's were not at all healthy and most died young. Native Americans/Aboriginals, were indeed healthy. inuit's now get food shipped to them and they shop like every other Westerner. That is why their health and livelyhood has increased. bt again, nobody is saying hunting for survival is wrong. We are talking about the seal hunt that is commercialized. Two totally seperate subjects. Inuit people do not take part in the hunt b.c they do not eat Harp seals. </div></div>They both go hand in hand. Westerners made it commercialized. Why are they taking all the heat for it? It's their way of life.

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:42 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">In your beliefs then, b.c a disabled person may not be at the level to function as said "superior" human with a functioning brain or body-they are not equal in the fact that they can suffer and feel pain. </div></div>

Red Rose, I'm not quite sure why you spend so much time lamenting the supposed weakness of the debating skills of those who disagree with you, when in the first sentences of your reply you construct a straw man and engage in a non sequiter.

If you want people to understand what you are saying without skewing what you are saying, then you must do the same in reciprocation.

Out of my post you created a strawman to knock down. Not once did I say anything that came close to your implication. How you could equate from my post animal cruelty to a human who is disabled is quite disingenuous on your part.

Let's keep the discussion focussed.

she
04-07-2008, 07:43 PM
RedRose said.. "and they shop like every other Westerner." A case of pop is $58.00 and a pack of smokes is $19.00. They pay a bit more than us.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:44 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?
</div></div>Excellent argument she. This is very true. Also, Native Americans and Inuits were much healthier than the Europeans before they settled in North America. Their diets consisted of wild plants, fruits, vegetables, meats and fish including the seal. If someone can think of a better way where these people in the north can have a better diet than what they have now and a better way to provide income for their families, step up to the plate. I'm sure their all ears. Until you've actually been up there and truly know what it's like living and growing up in that part of the world, everyone should think twice about seal hunting. They probably think our way of life if pathetic. They don't have all of our luxuries that we take for granted here. They don't have grocery stores where everything is imported, they don't have a steel plant where they can go to work every day. If they do have grocery and supply stores up there, do you have any idea what it costs them for food and groceries? </div></div>

I'm sorry, but you are talking about a seperate subject. Nobody is against people living and eating off their own land. btw, It should be noted with all due respect, that Inuit's used to die early, of disease caused by bad meat. Their body's were not at all healthy and most died young. Native Americans/Aboriginals, were indeed healthy. inuit's now get food shipped to them and they shop like every other Westerner. That is why their health and livelyhood has increased. bt again, nobody is saying hunting for survival is wrong. We are talking about the seal hunt that is commercialized. Two totally seperate subjects. Inuit people do not take part in the hunt b.c they do not eat Harp seals. </div></div>They both go hand in hand. Westerners turned made it commercialized. Why are they taking all the heat for it? </div></div>
It doesn't go hand in hand. How do you not understand that mass slaughter of an animal and one or two seals to feed a few tribes is NOT the same. Inuit's do not take part in the mass slaughter of animals. Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction. Can you not see how there is a difference?
There's a huge difference between living off the land and abusing the land.

"By the end of the 1870s, millions of buffalo had been slaughtered for sport, profit and military gain. Killing buffalo even became a past-time as sportsmen from Britain traveled to the plains to take part in the hunt."


The near extinction wasn't caused by using the animals as needed. Mass slaughter is wrong. It's wasteful-and we'll end up with nothing left. If you can't see the difference between living off the land and commercialized mass slaughter-then it isn't my fault. It's the first thing we're taught in like, grade 4 when we learn about Aboriginals.

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:47 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction. Can you not see how there is a difference? </div></div>

You are correct...to a point.

There were and are indeed instances where Aboriginals respected and nurtured the land and animals, and the White Man acted poorly and greedily.

However, there are instances where the opposite is also true.

The reason you are having a hard time getting others to see your point is, in part, due to the fact you're trying to turn this into a race-based issue.

Each side has more than their share to account for, so trying to make one side look superior to the other is a losing proposition.

The Berean
04-07-2008, 07:49 PM
The americans killed the buffalo to starve the indians.

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:50 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's the first thing we're taught in like, grade 4 when we learn about Aboriginals </div></div>

And some of it is historical revisionism, pure and simple.

Some histories are written to make the White Man look better then they were, and in order to counteract that other histories were written that made the Aboriginals look better than they were.

The truth lies in the middle.

Read how utterly destructive Native Americans were toward the earth as far as farming and agricultural techniques are concerned. It took European agricultural practices to teach Natives how to use plots of land over and over, instead of planting for one season, leaving the land for dead, and moving on. Besides hunting needs, that is the main reason why tribes were nomadic.

On the other side, Europeans learned much from Natives on how to respect and revere animals.

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:51 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ConKat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The americans killed the buffalo to starve the indians. </div></div>

And the Canadians killed off the First Nations people for sport, or so it seems.

The Berean
04-07-2008, 07:52 PM
The americans were much better at it. After all, some indians fled to Canada to be safe.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:54 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction. Can you not see how there is a difference? </div></div>

You are correct...to a point.

There were and are indeed instances where Aboriginals respected and nurtured the land and animals, and the White Man acted poorly and greedily.

However, there are instances where the opposite is also true.

The reason you are having a hard time getting others to see your point is, in part, due to the fact you're trying to turn this into a race-based issue.

Each side has more than their share to account for, so trying to make one side look superior to the other is a losing proposition. </div></div>
No i'm not!!!! I'm not the one bringing the Inuit's an daboriginals into this! they were actually. I've stated over and over I am not against people living off the land, but they keep on going on about it and they keep havinga need to compare the two, which they aren't the same thing.
All I've said is that i'm against the commercialized seal hunt. I said the other issues i'm not against. I did not bring race into it, READ again. They keep twisting my words, when all i'm saying is that living off the land is different than what they are doing with the seal hunt now. So explain to me how "i" brought up race as a point when i am not the one who cares about it. Read the post prior to my own..Others were the one's to keep on going on about the life of tribal people..not me...
and where they got the idea i was against ppl living off the land as a way to survive is beyond me, b.c they are pulling on teeth for that.
I am only against seal hunting commercially-how many times must I state this?

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:54 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: ConKat</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The americans were much better at it. After all, some indians fled to Canada to be safe. </div></div>

Right. And once there, they were put in your government schools, and abused, ruining generations of First Nations people.

Bravo.

she
04-07-2008, 07:55 PM
This is not a black and white issue. This is a wonderful thread that brings to the attenion of opposing views, information , that they may not know about. Education is the key here and fair play crucial to bringing about enlightenment. It is true that watching seals killed is unpleasant(for most). And it is also true that opposing the seal hunt is a huge money maker. Why not fight for the rights of animals that are on the endangered species list (no money there/not graphic and sympathy inducing)why not allow cameras in a slaughter house. This debate will hopefully bring about more questions than answers.

GenX
04-07-2008, 07:56 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I am only against seal hunting commercially-how many times must I state this?</div></div>

Then why do you discuss Aboriginals and "the White Man" so much?

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:57 PM
Why not fight for the animals BEFORE they end up on the endangered list? Why should we wait until it's almost too late? and there ppl go again, assuming b.c ppl care about ONE cause that they don't put their heart into others as well. That's not true.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 07:59 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I am only against seal hunting commercially-how many times must I state this?</div></div>

Then why do you discuss Aboriginals and "the White Man" so much? </div></div>

I keep being asked about them!!! so all i say is that eating off the land is different than mass slaughter. I wasn't the one to start that one. Go back and re read. I believe ppl like, stingray were confronting me on the races-and I wa sjust pointing out they have a right to eat, but we don't have a right to kill them by mass slaughter(or shouldnt not anyways, ) sorry if there was confusion.

GenX
04-07-2008, 08:00 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They keep twisting my words, when all i'm saying is that living off the land is different than what they are doing with the seal hunt now. So explain to me how "i" brought up race as a point when i am not the one who cares about it </div></div>

Here are your words: Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction.

That is false, because it is a gross overstatement.

Depending on the tribe, you can find instances of Native American slaughter of certain herds of animals, just as you can certainly find instances of WASP abuse of animals.

I see what you're saying...all I'm saying is that such gross over-simplifications just muddle the discussion.

Larimar
04-07-2008, 08:02 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">They keep twisting my words, when all i'm saying is that living off the land is different than what they are doing with the seal hunt now. So explain to me how "i" brought up race as a point when i am not the one who cares about it </div></div>

Here are your words: Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction.

That is false, because it is a gross overstatement.

Depending on the tribe, you can find instances of Native American slaughter of certain herds of animals, just as you can certainly find instances od WASP abuse of animals. </div></div>
Again, you're missing the point! what are you trying to do? Someone told me mass slaughter of seals and eating off the land like an aboriginal were one in the same. I was only saying that ppl can live off the land without killing the species off. And in history there are examples of this. I was using ONE popular instance to show how MASS slaughter of an animal can lead to extinction, while eating off the land and respecting it is fine-that i'm not against. I was not saying ALL aboriginals or ALL situations. Just trying to show them how it IS different.
Do you understand now? I didn't bring it up, someone asked me. Of course, no animal is on the endangered list-and is always plentiful until they are continuasly mass slaughtered-the effects won't be felt for generations-especially as many die b.c of global warming.
anyhow, so I'm going to eat now and let this thread rest in peace. There's no positivity here, only anger it seems. Comparing apples and oranges and accusing me of being against things I'm not-is difficult to keep things on subject. I shouldn't be talking about aboriginals-RWG is right...so since I can't talk about the real issue without ppl bringing in other subjects and strawman arguements, I'll leave..until someone has something informative to speak.

peace all, have fun!

Nihilistic Heathen
04-07-2008, 08:16 PM
How come people keep talking like the seal's are going extinct? They aren't even near the endagered species list. The only reason we hear so much noise this time a year about seal hunting is because the anti-seal organisations are earning more than the sealers who are hunting the seals. They are sensationalising the hunt by making false claims that are being reiterated in the media and on here.

As I have pointed out there have been independent studies that have shown that the seal hunt is done humanely.

KDawg
04-07-2008, 08:19 PM
I did not want to wade through 20 pages of this, so I apologize if someone else has already talked about this.

The seal hunt is as much about protecting Atlantic fish stocks as it is about hunting seals. And the hunt is not a mass slaughter -- From the BBC:
"The harp seal herd - the most important seal herd for this industry - is estimated at around five million animals, nearly the highest level ever recorded, and almost triple what it was in the 1970s."

I dare say there wouldn't be such an uproar about this if the seal pups weren't so cute.

Strife
04-07-2008, 09:05 PM
See thats what I dont understand about some people. Ofcourse mass killing creatures to extinction is wrong but when it is controlled and brings profit, it can be a good thing.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KDawg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I dare say there wouldn't be such an uproar about this if the seal pups weren't so cute.</div></div>

Amen! You dont hear about the killing of deer or other wildlife animals. Its not necessary for survival so why arent people b!tchin about that?

Macs II
04-07-2008, 09:29 PM
The Canadian hunt (http://www.mypointis.net/thesealhunt.html)

Stingray
04-07-2008, 09:33 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Dreamspirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: RedRose</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Stingray</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: she</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The Inuit Paradox

It is interesting to note that cardiovascular disease is rare in Inuit people who continue to eat their traditional diet.
How can eating a <span style="color: #FF0000">diet predominantly consisting of seal meat</span>, fat and blubber and almost completely devoid of greens, fruits and fibre be preventative for the disease that plagues the Western world, and for which medical orthodoxy blames on diets high in saturated fats and cholesterol?

Also, in spite of adopting modern medicine’s low-fat, low-cholesterol diet and drug regimes, cardiovascular disease continues to increase in the West with no cures in site. Herein lies the paradox: if high fat and high cholesterol diets cause cardiovascular disease, what is protecting the traditional Inuit, who thrive on a diet rich in both?
</div></div>Excellent argument she. This is very true. Also, Native Americans and Inuits were much healthier than the Europeans before they settled in North America. Their diets consisted of wild plants, fruits, vegetables, meats and fish including the seal. If someone can think of a better way where these people in the north can have a better diet than what they have now and a better way to provide income for their families, step up to the plate. I'm sure their all ears. Until you've actually been up there and truly know what it's like living and growing up in that part of the world, everyone should think twice about seal hunting. They probably think our way of life if pathetic. They don't have all of our luxuries that we take for granted here. They don't have grocery stores where everything is imported, they don't have a steel plant where they can go to work every day. If they do have grocery and supply stores up there, do you have any idea what it costs them for food and groceries? </div></div>

I'm sorry, but you are talking about a seperate subject. Nobody is against people living and eating off their own land. btw, It should be noted with all due respect, that Inuit's used to die early, of disease caused by bad meat. Their body's were not at all healthy and most died young. Native Americans/Aboriginals, were indeed healthy. inuit's now get food shipped to them and they shop like every other Westerner. That is why their health and livelyhood has increased. bt again, nobody is saying hunting for survival is wrong. We are talking about the seal hunt that is commercialized. Two totally seperate subjects. Inuit people do not take part in the hunt b.c they do not eat Harp seals. </div></div>They both go hand in hand. Westerners turned made it commercialized. Why are they taking all the heat for it? </div></div>
It doesn't go hand in hand. How do you not understand that mass slaughter of an animal and one or two seals to feed a few tribes is NOT the same. Inuit's do not take part in the mass slaughter of animals. Aboriginal's also did not mass slaughter animals, they respected the land-The buffallo were used for sustanance..Than white man came a long and slaughtered them to near extinction. Can you not see how there is a difference?
There's a huge difference between living off the land and abusing the land.

"By the end of the 1870s, millions of buffalo had been slaughtered for sport, profit and military gain. Killing buffalo even became a past-time as sportsmen from Britain traveled to the plains to take part in the hunt."


The near extinction wasn't caused by using the animals as needed. Mass slaughter is wrong. It's wasteful-and we'll end up with nothing left. If you can't see the difference between living off the land and commercialized mass slaughter-then it isn't my fault. It's the first thing we're taught in like, grade 4 when we learn about Aboriginals. </div></div>And my point was obviously misunderstood. I was simply trying to state that today’s seal hunting and doing it for money, yes it does go hand in hand. It is western culture that pushes and almost forces the inuit to mass hunt and slaughter the seals. If they have a better diet now, so be it, but they still have to come up with cash so they can afford to pay for their modern day food. I’m not trying to mix race into it and who’s the better race. Today’s society and westerners are a big part as to why the seal hunting has turned into what it is. As long as western society keeps buying seal skin, the more the hunting will continue. So rather than trying to put all the blame on all of the seal hunters out there, the consumers are the ones who really should be targeted. We are no more innocent than the seal hunters when it comes to the destruction of our planet. Everything we use in our daily lives affects our planet, ie: paper, furniture and housing leads to deforestation which is destroying all natural plant and wild life. Modern vehicles, fruit and vegetables from canned goods etc… leads to mining, which in effect pollutes the lands and the waters, which in effect poisons all natural habitat which ultimately affects all of us humans. It’s one big circle where not one of us is more innocent than the other. I myself do not agree with hunting any animal for that matter for personal financial gain unless it’s to support yourself and family and no greed is involved.

riggs
04-07-2008, 09:38 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: KDawg</div><div class="ubbcode-body">

The seal hunt is as much about protecting Atlantic fish stocks as it is about hunting seals. </div></div>

As I said earlier they are eliminating a predator to increase the yeilds for the industry.It's a short cut to protecting the environment.

MaO3
04-07-2008, 09:47 PM
This is what bothers me the most.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These pups have yet to eat their first solid food or learn how to swim. When the large sealing vessels arrive, they literally have nowhere to escape. The skin is taken out and the carcass is left to roth in the ice. The hunters , don't have any use for the rest of the body. Ocassionaly , the flippers are taken and the male genitals .This is NOT a hunt for survival , not a hunt to feed humans , it's plain vanity and politics.
</div></div>

tippikitty
04-07-2008, 09:57 PM
dido

metal_gods
04-07-2008, 10:28 PM
There will always be more pups born to keep the population going

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 11:52 PM
That is just stomach turning to hear that and what they do to the poor seals..OMG! Does human and I mean all human of all race not have a clue what they are really doing, do they not have a heart? This is not hunting for food or survival at all!!! The people who buy Seal skin boots...fur jackets of any animal etc are the ones to really blame for all this animal slaugtering that is going on...and Metal Gods you should take a reality check! One day these pups they way it is going will not populate and when our kids grow up they may be no seals in the wild only captivity left swallow that! For years all race around the world have been killing animals for certain parts to make boots etc...it has to stop somewhere look at all the animals that are now no longer in this world and that only took a matter of 50 years for alot of them to become extinct thanks to us!!! I never see animals ripping our skin off and leaving our [censored] to die for money or to make them selves some boots!!! Animals have right to live as well...and this type of seal hunting is def not for food just greed and boots!!! Well done everybody destroy everything earth has to offer so one day there will be nothing but dirt.

aussie_angel24
04-07-2008, 11:59 PM
http://www.hsus.org/protect_seals.html

this is very disturbing...

Macs II
04-08-2008, 12:00 AM
It's no different than killing of elephants for their ivory tusks ...it's about money not survival.

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 12:04 AM
That is so true Macs and that is what I was getting at...it is all about greed and money!

kitca
04-08-2008, 12:12 AM
...and the killing of rhino's for their tusks, and the killing of tigers for their genitals, and the killing of black bears for their gall bladder, and on and on and on...

Evangeline
04-08-2008, 12:19 AM
Dreamspirit why are you even bothering with moochi, their opinion keep wavering back and forth, and they are arguing subjects that they know nothing about, it looks from this thread that they are about 13, and just spouting whatever they can to try to keep up with the convo, with the occasional macs bash thrown in for good measure.

I am anti the seal hunt, as was stated it's the wrong seal being hunted by the wrong people, and it's being done in a cruel way. Personally I think eating any meat eating animal is disgusting, predators are not meant to eat other predators, it's like eating your cat or dog. I can understand people eating what is in their area to survive, but once it isn't necessary for survival it's lost it's point. The fur industry is a disgusting business, thier practices are ridiculously inhumane, and all for the purpose of fashion. Cruelty at it's best. Fur for survial is one thing, not that that is very often nessesary now, and when it was they used all of the animal, because they were trying to survive not make a fashion statement.

And saying animals cannot be skinned alive is very, very wrong, I've seen footage where they show the animal being skinned, then they focus in on it laying on a pile or corpses of it's fellow animals and it lifts it's head, looks around and blinks. Imagine being alive with no flesh on you and dying slowly because of it. Discusting. It's like out of a horror movie.

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 12:23 AM
For all who say the killing is humane this comes from the protect the seals website...

Myth: The seal hunt is humane.

Fact: In 2001, an independent veterinary panel performed post-mortems on seal carcasses abandoned on the ice floes. Their report concluded that in 42 percent of cases, the seals did not show enough evidence of cranial injury to even guarantee unconsciousness at the time of skinning. This report is supported by the testimony of independent journalists, parliamentarians and scientists who observe and document the commercial seal hunt each year. Footage from the commercial seal hunt consistently shows conscious pups stabbed with boathooks and dragged across the ice, wounded pups left to choke on their own blood and conscious seal pups cut open. Video footage of the 2005 hunt can be viewed at http://www.protectseals.org.

Watch and after watching if you find how they kill humane...you really have issues!

jwarner-smith
04-08-2008, 01:22 AM
It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you.

SusyQ
04-08-2008, 01:26 AM
Kinda harshly said their Major don't you think?

Stingray
04-08-2008, 01:32 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's the first thing we're taught in like, grade 4 when we learn about Aboriginals </div></div>

The truth lies in the middle.

Read how utterly destructive Native Americans were toward the earth as far as farming and agricultural techniques are concerned. It took European agricultural practices to teach Natives how to use plots of land over and over, instead of planting for one season, leaving the land for dead, and moving on. Besides hunting needs, that is the main reason why tribes were nomadic.

On the other side, Europeans learned much from Natives on how to respect and revere animals. </div></div>

You have your history and facts wrong, natives did know how to farm, europeans learned many techniques from them that are still being used today by farmers around the world. They didn't leave the land for dead, farmers today leave the land for dead, that's why they keep having to refertilize their fields. Today, modern agriculture supplies us with a surfeit of just about any food we might desire, but at what cost? While systemized, large-scale agriculture delivered last century's much ballyhooed agricultural revolution, history tells us that unsound farming methods can cause the collapse of civilizations. Past civilizations have literally farmed themselves to death, by ravaging surrounding resources, using habitat-incompatible farming methods, and living at a resource deficit; which all inevitably leads to societal collapse. Now, it seems, Western civilization may once again be staring down the barrel, as studies into today's commercial farming practices show that they are having a negative effect on crop yields, nutrient content and the environment. You call that teaching the natives how to farm? I don't think native people left themselves in that situation. They were nomadic because they had freedome. They didn't want to live in the same place for years and years till they rotted, they loved to explore and live off the land for it's beauty. Europeans had no respect for anything, it was all about greed and gold. Look at all the mining and deforestation that's going on today, you definitely have your facts wrong! But that's a different story, oops, sorry, we're talking about seals, lol

GoldDogs
04-08-2008, 02:42 AM
You cannot make the seal hunt illegal unfortunately. The economy in the eastern provinces is already garbage taking away one more trade would ruin so many individuals.

MaO3
04-08-2008, 09:05 AM
Regardless of what People like MMM say about the seal hunt, and frankly I don't give a flying fig what you have to say, MY issue with the seal hunt is the way that they are harvested, and the non-use of the meat. I'm a "Carnivour" yes, I said it I eat meat, and I like it. We hunt, and fish and I eat it too. But the big difference is that we do it humanely. Clubbing a animal and skinning it - in some cases ALIVE is wrong. I don't buy into the crap but this has been proven.

So if that makes me a GOOF - well I guess that I am.

Stingray
04-08-2008, 09:26 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Major Matt Mason</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you. </div></div> minor matt mason, you just started a war. I hope you have your helmet on because you're going to get clobbered, lol!

dancingqueen
04-08-2008, 09:28 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Major Matt Mason</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you. </div></div>

do you deny that there are more humane ways of dispatching these seals?
just because they use cute lil pictures does not mean this is the source of our displeasure... I am pretty sure that aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of us heard the person say "This pup is too young to be clubbed" on the video. So, these people may be good, simple, hard working people, but I fail to understand why they can't just throw "humane" in there.
P.S It is possible to make a point without resorting to something as childish as name calling

Stingray
04-08-2008, 09:30 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Major Matt Mason</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you. </div></div>

do you deny that there are more humane ways of dispatching these seals?
just because they use cute lil pictures does not mean this is the source of our displeasure... I am pretty sure that aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of us heard the person say "This pup is too young to be clubbed" on the video. So, these people may be good, simple, hard working people, but I fail to understand why they can't just throw "humane" in there.
P.S It is possible to make a point without resorting to something as childish as name calling </div></div>Well said dancing queen. It's something to have your opinion, but when you have to stoop down to name calling to prove a point, then that is pretty goofy and childish

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 11:34 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Major Matt Mason</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you.</div></div>

Yep well I am standing up to what I believe in so if that makes me a GOOF well heck I am proud to be one!!! Firstly get your facts straight the seal pups have their throats slit open or their skinn ripped off while they are still alive and they are not even old enough for their first feed!!! Watch the evidence it is all right there... Humane is the word and how the seals are slaughted is far from humane...they tear off the skin and then rest of the seal is left to rot on the ice, cruel and wasteful! At least the inuits also use the meat they do not just take the skin for profit or leave the rest of the seal to rot where as most other seal hunting only take the skin for money and leave the rest! It is also a myth that is a humane way of killing the seals that is even written in so many sites...A MYTH! Soon the way the seals are killed will be made illegal because of it's cruel manner, they are already working on doing that and soon those seals that are used for harvest will be a protected species that is also been worked on. Let me tell you something I love been a GOOF and trying to conserve what we have in the wild today for my children when they grow up and have kids of their very own.!!!

she
04-08-2008, 12:00 PM
"In the United States, around ten billion (thousand million) animals are slaughtered every year in 5,700 slaughterhouses and processing plants employing 527,000 workers;[1] in 2007, 28.1 billion pounds of beef were consumed in the U.S. alone.[2] In Canada, 650 million are killed annually.[3] In the Europe Union, the annual figure is 300 million cattle, sheep, and pigs, and four billion chickens.[4]"

In essence, the Canadian seal hunt is no different than any abattoir anywhere in western society: except it is done in the open on the ice flows or open waters off the eastern and northern coasts of Canada.

No animal killing is pretty but the objective of Canadian sealers is to kill humanely: and they do. Study after study has shown that both weapons kill efficiently and humanely.

New harp seal quota for 2007 hunt: 270,000
Harp seal quota for 2006 hunt: 325,000
Estimated size of the seal herd off Atlantic Canada: 5.5 million

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 01:31 PM
Humane...it is not ripping a animals skin off while the animal is till alive. If you think they way they are slaughted is humane you need a reality check or you have serious issues. Once again check your facts yes the weapons may be proven to be humane but they way the seals are slaughted is far by humane...the evidence is out there everywhere and they are trying to put a stop to it!!!

bohd
04-08-2008, 02:00 PM
she, mmm, well put (except for the put downs) as a huter, i try and dispatch animals as quickly as i can...sometimes that does not happen and i end up tracking down a wounded animal. HATE IT, but it happens.....not humane at all, but i do my best so that this doesnt happen. now why would you think all the seal hunters would want an inhumane act to characterize their hunt.
do most of you think that these HUNTERS want skin a live seal. do these HUNTERS want to torture and mutilate baby seals?
i am sure that they are taught how to use that HEAVY club in a manner that dispatches these seals quickly. sometimes they may miss their mark and have to hit again but this is quick .
if these are true hunters in the they DO NOT want to see the seal suffer. again if any of you want to go and watch your chickens, beef, pigs being slaughtered...go do it, see first hand real slaughter and how cruel it is. we must do this in order to survive.....i admire vegetarianss and their convictions but living in a cold environment does allow some of us the luxury of a vegeterian diet ....

dancingqueen
04-08-2008, 02:29 PM
aren't there other ways to kill them without damaging the skin? I would excpect there are...

she
04-08-2008, 03:35 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: aussie_angel24</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Humane...it is not ripping a animals skin off while the animal is till alive. If you think they way they are slaughted is humane you need a reality check or you have serious issues. Once again check your facts yes the weapons may be proven to be humane but they way the seals are slaughted is far by humane...the evidence is out there everywhere and they are trying to put a stop to it!!! </div></div>
Skinning Alive


This is one of the most ridiculous and nefarious of the many outrageous statements made by the animal rights movement and, sadly, one that the media “buys into’ without ever researching the myriad of reputable international and domestic studies that show that sealing is simply an outdoor abattoir. An abattoir like any licensed abattoirs throughout western society where the killing is conducted in a proper and humane fashion.

Animal rights fanatics recognize two important facts when propagating this slander. First: the majority of urban people have never seen their food or clothing killed and are repulsed by the optics of killing: all killing not just seals. Second: dead seals continue to wiggle and move in much the same way that a chicken with its head cut off continues to run about. Third: video/images can in and of itself portray things as they are NOT and when coupled with carefully chosen narration can reinforce any message the producer wishes to convey: moving or still pictures do not lie is one of the great fallacies and this has been known by propagandists since the 19th century.

The movements many animals make when dead are simply reflex actions and do not indicate that the animal is alive.

As any abattoir worker or hunter will explain to you, based upon experience, that skinning an animal is difficult enough when they are dead and near impossible to do when they are alive. Additionally, common sense tells you that when the value of the pelt depends on the quality (straight cuts improve the value) it makes no sense to ruin a pelt by trying to skin the animal alive. Unless, of course, you accept the animal rights fanatic’s contention that sealers are some kind of barbarian sub-humans and not your neighbours who live in the villages and towns strung along shores of the North Atlantic Ocean, the Bearing and Arctic Seas. And the same condemnation applies to your neighbours who work in abattoirs, hunt or slaughter animals on farms throughout Canada, the USA and Europe. Not to mention those hired by the governments of the above-mentioned societies to kill animals determined to be pests by urban dwellers.

Study after study by reputable, international veterinarians have shown time after time that skinning alive is a lie perpetrated by so called independent studies conducted, paid for and written by the staff members of animal rights groups and never peer group reviewed for methodology or accuracy.

What looks ugly is not wrong. If ugly is portrayed as wrong and pretty is portrayed as right there is a large segment of the world’s human population which needs to seek cover. Ugly and pretty have no moral value, they are simply in the eye of the beholder.
from: http://www.thesealfishery.com/

she
04-08-2008, 03:43 PM
bohd said "she, mmm, well put (except for the put downs) "

bohd, I am not sure what you are referring to as "the put downs" and if I have offened you please accept my apologies. My only aim here is to inform and hopefully englighten by busting a few myths propogated by those that make HUGE profits by protesting the hunt. The monies raised through these protests does not go toward animal welfare but into the purses/pockets of the organizers. Their yearly salaries are huge. Profit is the main aim of those organizing the protesters.
I have done a bit of research on both sides of this debate and as I stated before, neither side is 100% right or 100% wrong.

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 03:53 PM
My opinions on the matter will and always will remain the same regardless of what you most annoying and argumentative sooneters have to say...I find many of you's on every topic very very annoying to read!!! I especailly do not take any concern for words from you people who sit on this thing all day everyday...there is a life out there take it!!!

dancingqueen
04-08-2008, 03:56 PM
just what we need, more people making personal attacks *rolls eyes*

aussie_angel24
04-08-2008, 03:57 PM
Hey just been very very honest!!!

Evangeline
04-08-2008, 04:00 PM
no honesty on soonet please.

she
04-08-2008, 04:05 PM
Hey. A few months ago there was another thread that someone started on the seal hunt and it only got to about 10 posts before it was deleted by mods for personal attacks. This thread having gone this far with this many views and posts is great. Hopefully a few people who are openminded enough have come to understand and appreciate more than one point of view.

((not as many views as the timmies girl, but hey ! , its a start !!))

jwarner-smith
04-08-2008, 05:50 PM
FINALLY ... someone on this thread that makes sense. Bravo "she"

I found some interesting reading on a link that you posted to The Seal Fishery (http://www.thesealfishery.com)

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> 95% of the seals killed last year were shot, that’s 95%. Why in the world do you focus on the hakapik as a reason to stop the hunt when 95% of seals are shot? As stated repeatedly, the hakapik has been proven in multiple international reports to be the best tool to use. The men who go out to kill seals risk their lives to provide for their families, that is not the description of a coward.</div></div>

jaydee
04-09-2008, 12:36 AM
i still think the wind could blow you over if youre vegan! /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

dancingqueen
04-09-2008, 03:22 AM
A healthy vegan can still get all the required protein in their meals. Chick peas, Tofu, all legumes, milk... the list goes on

jaydee
04-09-2008, 03:24 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A healthy vegan can still get all the required protein in their meals. Chick peas, Tofu, all legumes, milk... the list goes on </div></div>

a true vegan cant have milk or eggs, it should be soy milk maybe? if any??

jaydee
04-09-2008, 03:26 AM
question though: is it true that if you eat meat it sits and rots in your intenstine, i mean all of it, like what happens to it, you dont poop out meat do you? or is this just a scare tactic to get people to quit eating meat and go vegan?

Larimar
04-09-2008, 03:39 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body">question though: is it true that if you eat meat it sits and rots in your intenstine, i mean all of it, like what happens to it, you dont poop out meat do you? or is this just a scare tactic to get people to quit eating meat and go vegan? </div></div>
Moochi
In true predatory animals they hav ea short digestive tract so taht when they eat raw meat it goes quickly out of the system and back to umm mother nature lol-as poop.
Humans also have it come out, but we don't hav ethe same digestive system that the predators-like the wolf, dog, or lion do. It is a very looooong process. Up to 48 or hours maybe longer I think to get out of you. So Yeah, while it's in you it does go bad/rot. That's why it's very easy for a human to get a disease or get sick from uncooked meat and a dog won't care if there's a little blood.
Your system does have trouble breaking it down with the acid.
Meat should make you fuller and more bloated for longer. Meat is flesh, so of course it will rot. Everything if left in your stomach-including veges and fruits would rot only thing is it is digested faster and easier and goes through you faster. This is why it doesn't get the chance.
but yah, meat needs to rot in the body for it to be digested...that takes a long time..It's not harmful tho unless u eat bad meat.
anywho..Only answering b.c It was asked, and I thought it was a sincere question.

jaydee
04-09-2008, 03:45 AM
ok then so anyone find it disgusting that meat just rots inside of ya? especially these ppl that eat lots of meat, imagine looking inside and seeing all the meat rotting /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

Larimar
04-09-2008, 03:55 AM
well, I dunno if it actually sits there roting, but it is being pushed thru your system..just takes a long time. I think rare meat (steak)takes longer than something like fish or chicken.

bohd
04-09-2008, 01:07 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Major Matt Mason</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It's an interesting coincidence that we're celebrating the anniversary of the birth of P.T. Barnum today. He's the circus entrepreneur of the late 1800's who said, "there's a sucker born every minute."

You people have absolutely no clue what you're talking about. You've simply bought into the misinformation being spewed out by Paul Watson and all the vegans at the militant US Humane Society. These people behind these organizations are pocketing millions of dollars donated by gullible simpletons like most of you on this board.

Your tiny little brains are overwhelmed by the cuteness of the pictures of the seal pups (that aren't even harvested because they're too young) that they pepper their sites with.

The TRUTH is, the people who engage in the seal harvest make marginal livings at best and without it, most of the harvesters would not survive. These are good simple folk just trying to get by and the corporate charities are taking advantage of their struggle to make a huge dollar from GOOFS like aussie, kitca, Macs, Ma03 and all the rest of you.</div></div>
she , this was the put down i was referring to....

she
04-09-2008, 01:31 PM
bohd, oh. Thanks for clarifying. I thought you were refering to something I said.

dancingqueen
04-09-2008, 04:01 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: moooochi</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: dancingqueen</div><div class="ubbcode-body">A healthy vegan can still get all the required protein in their meals. Chick peas, Tofu, all legumes, milk... the list goes on </div></div>

a true vegan cant have milk or eggs, it should be soy milk maybe? if any?? </div></div>

I stand corrected, but yes, soy milk has proteins in it as well.

Nihilistic Heathen
04-14-2008, 03:33 PM
Not to beat a dead horse but I came across this video on youtube that I thought I would share...

Barbara Frum - Paul Watson Interview, 1978 CBC (http://youtube.com/watch?v=H_gTBDFTXE0)

Larimar
04-14-2008, 03:54 PM
I once saw an interview with someone labled as a "doctor" saying a vegetarian diet was bad. It took a LOT of research but I found out this so called doctor talking on a health show was in fact a biased woman hired by the meat industry to use her name and voice for their purposes..this so called doctor was in fact a doctor of dreams...psychology..nothing to do with nutrition and diets. So it's easy to learn that interviews don't really prove much or tell the truth in all cases. There are freuds on all sides of the issues. All people can do is use their own logic and come to their own conclusion.
I think many organizations are helping a lot more than the seal hunt, but the media is the one giving it all the attention, not the animal rights people. You can find animal rights people all over- circuses, puppymills, factory farms..so not just seal hunts...It's the media that focuses on the "cute" factor.
That's why you wont see many news reports on cute happy pitbulls...it wont sell..
They like to focus on the negative aspects of them or nothing at all unfortunately. So I really thikn the interviewers have it wrong. Animals rights are all over the place ...and the interview is forgetting the fact that animal rights is about rights...and well beig of animals..so it focuses on cruelty-not just endangered animals..but dogs in humane societies even..and dogs certainly aren't underpopulated...
so I think it misses the point.
the media is the one focused on one thing...
jmho

Nihilistic Heathen
04-14-2008, 04:12 PM
Nice strawman.

she
04-14-2008, 04:22 PM
Thank you for posting that link.I was glad to see the information at the end of the video since it is so relevant.

403_forbidden
04-14-2008, 04:45 PM
Meat rotting inside human digestive tract?? Meat is one of the more digestible foods we can eat. It doesn't rot in our digestive system. Through a series of chemical and biochemical reactions it is broken down into individual amino acids (and fatty acids) for the body to use it in tissue and muscle growth and maintenance. If that is your definition of rotting than okay all the food (meat, fruit and vegetables) we eat rots in our bodies. In a normal operating human digestive system meat is digested more completely than say a stick of celery that contains more indigestible compounds.

kitca
04-14-2008, 05:36 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: There's no Place Like 127.0.0.1</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Meat rotting inside human digestive tract?? Meat is one of the more digestible foods we can eat. It doesn't rot in our digestive system. Through a series of chemical and biochemical reactions it is broken down into individual amino acids (and fatty acids) for the body to use it in tissue and muscle growth and maintenance. If that is your definition of rotting than okay all the food (meat, fruit and vegetables) we eat rots in our bodies. In a normal operating human digestive system meat is digested more completely than say a stick of celery that contains more indigestible compounds. </div></div>

dont you remember the health guy in "beverly hills cop" said the average person has at least 5 pounds of undigested red meat stuck in their intestines. thats good enough for me!

403_forbidden
04-15-2008, 09:42 AM
When it comes to science and biology, I am not sure that Berverly Hills Cop movie or any Hollywood movie production is very accurate about facts.

If food is not moving through healthy intestines properly it is most likely due to improper diet and not eating a variety of fruits, vegetables and YES meat. You need fibre in your diet to aid in the digestion of all foods that go into your body.

Larimar
04-15-2008, 03:07 PM
" Meat is one of the more digestible foods we can eat." False.
Fruit is the easiest-I think around a half hour to 30 minutes to go through and digest.

Meat takes longer to, and b.c it is more difficult to digest, requires more action on the body's part to oxidate more. Thi scauses the release of free radicals-(for those that aren't aware the def: "Highly reactive molecules capable of causing damage in brain and other tissue. Free radicals are common by-products of normal chemical reactions") The more difficult it is to digest something the more free radicals are released into your body, as is the case with meat. It leaves stuff over called Purines which moves through the intestine(which can cause gout).
It can take days for our body to heat up the food and in which time toxins are sent through the body which is why it is said meat is causing cancer.


a quote "
Dr. T. Colin Campbell, arguably the foremost epidemiological researcher alive today, argues that animal proteins are the prime carcinogen in meat and dairy products. Says Dr. Campbell, "[H]uman studies also support this carcinogenic effect of animal protein, even at usual levels of consumption. No chemical carcinogen is nearly so important in causing human cancer as animal protein."


I'm not arguing against meat! I want to make that clear..I could care less what people put in their mouths. All I'm saying is that meat is harder and slower to digest which is why it can cause so many problems for the body if too much is consumed. Moderation is key if you eat meat-and lots of fiber will help in digesting it.
A little fun fact tho- If you eat potatoes with your meat it is not benificial.

"Another category is food combinations. That meat and potatoe combination so common to the western table is so foreign to the human stomach. The body digests things better when eaten separately. Proteins and carbohydrates or sugar is a very poor combination and results in the rotting of the protein right in the stomach and small intestines. That means proteins and fruit is a poor combination since fruit is mostly sugar."source-Dr. Robert Jackson.
Just thought that was interesting. I guess it's better to eat our foods seperately.

Koss
04-15-2008, 03:17 PM
My grandmother lived to be 104 and my grandfather 101 and were still active and alert up to their deaths eating all the meat they could get their hands on.