View Full Version : Age of the world....
Onlygodknowswhy
06-26-2008, 03:21 AM
Browsing the internet, (basically killing time) as you imagined just surfing and looking at anything that caught my eye......I was reading about the fossils of men found in asia and one stated that archaeologists have uncovered stone artifacts that are 800,000yrs, and a bunch of other pretty interesting things.....
So as im in the area of looking up articles like that, i see one with dinasaurs so i read a couple pages killing time...then i got to one that said dinosaurs and humans lived together and its proved in the bible.....it states that on the 6th day god created everything, and everything lived in harmony because everything alive was vegatarian....then adam committed a sin, then animals were eating, man was killing to eat and for pleasure....so noah came along and didnt save the dinosaurs because they were too big and drowned....and why we find them so far in the ground is because they were burried in mud slides......
I wasnt out looking for religious things online.....but stumbled across this.....and it is saying that the earth is only 6000yrs old.....and the bible is an accurate time frame from the beginning of man.........lets face it....our ancestors werent walking around with T-Rex
It's an acctual site http://www.answersingenesis.org/Docs/2.asp
I know the bible is a book of stories about a great man bringing good into this world...inspirational stories, moral stories.....but as man, we didnt wake up one day and start writing the word of god...but one disagreeing the world is older than 6000 yrs old would mean the first statement in the bible is false about the 6days.....
Where I would think that god being god,being outside of time, could have created the earth, then created the mountains, the oceans over vast amounts of time then created animals and creatures again over vast amounts of time, to eventually creating something in his image
Again my vote...the earth is well beyond 6000yrs old
Chakra
06-26-2008, 06:05 AM
There's no doubt the world is older then 6000 years. The first human civilizations are older than that.
Soundbear
06-26-2008, 08:45 AM
http://eastonsbibledictionary.com/d/day.htm
"The word "day" sometimes signifies an indefinite time (Genesis 2:4; Isaiah 22:5; Hebrews 3:8, etc.). In Job 3:1 it denotes a birthday, and in Isaiah 2:12, Acts 17:31, and 2 Timothy 1:18, the great day of final judgment."
“These [are] the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,” (Ge 2:4 AV)
If you believe in the Bible literally, you'd believe the earth is only 6,000 years old.
It is obviously much older than that.
4.5 billion years, give or take a couple of million.
BlueSky
06-30-2008, 07:04 PM
Is there anything in the Bible literally that indicates the age of the earth?
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 07:06 PM
No.
Not specifically.
But the number 6,000 is believed by many Christian fundamentalists because if you add up the years mentioned when discussing lifespans of certain individuals, especially in the Old Testament, it appears the earth is around 6,000 years old.
You can get that number by reading the OT backwards, so to speak.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">http://eastonsbibledictionary.com/d/day.htm
"The word "day" sometimes signifies an indefinite time (Genesis 2:4; Isaiah 22:5; Hebrews 3:8, etc.). In Job 3:1 it denotes a birthday, and in Isaiah 2:12, Acts 17:31, and 2 Timothy 1:18, the great day of final judgment."
“These [are] the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens,” (Ge 2:4 AV)
</div></div>
So when the Book of Daniel says the Anti-Christ will reign "Seven years", it is quite possible it doesn't mean anything close to what leading evangelicals such as Hal Lindsey says it means.
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 07:18 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not specifically.
But the number 6,000 is believed by many Christian fundamentalists because if you add up the years mentioned when discussing lifespans of certain individuals, especially in the Old Testament, it appears the earth is around 6,000 years old.
You can get that number by reading the OT backwards, so to speak. </div></div>
http://ntrminblog.blogspot.com/2005/08/untraditional-traditionalists-part-3.html
"They've been arguing for more than a century. They disagree about how to interpret dozens of Biblical passages. Many theological, moral, and practical issues are involved.
I'm referring to the dispute over the age of the earth. And who better to settle the dispute than the Roman Catholics, Eastern Orthodox, Anglicans, and others who tell us so often about their deep historical roots, their concern for church unity, and their unchanging traditions? The solution to this dispute over the age of the earth is at their fingertips, and surely they aren't afraid to speak the truth and preserve the tradition and unity of the church, even if it's culturally unpopular.
Because whatever issues the church fathers may have been unclear about, one issue about which they spoke in a clear manner was the issue of the age of the earth. The concept of a young earth or the recent creation of mankind is stated or implied in The Epistle of Barnabas (15), Justin Martyr (First Apology, 31), Theophilus of Antioch (To Autolycus, 3:24-25), Irenaeus (Against Heresies, 5:28:3), Clement of Alexandria (The Stromata, 1:21), Hippolytus (On Daniel, 2:6), Origen (Against Celsus, 1:20), Julius Afric**** (Chronology, 1), Cyprian (Treatise 11; Preface, 2; On the Exhortation to Martyrdom, 11), Victorinus (On the Creation of the World), Lactantius (The Divine Institutes, 7:14), and Augustine (City of God, 12:12), for example."
Barry, can you create a response?
Seems to me you've accused me of being "Mr. Copy n Paste" in here before. That is strange, if one looks back over your last few posts.
The Roman Catholic Church does not believe the earth is 6,000 years old. You pick out a few early Church Fathers, and want people to believe that represents the official view of the RCC.
One person's blog proves what, Barry? What exactly did those particular Church Fathers believe? Can you tell us?
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 07:31 PM
Just as soon as you substantiate, "But the number 6,000 is believed by many Christian fundamentalists.."
I'm pretty sure you've used the early church fathers argument in many many more posts than I have mentioned your copy and paste stuff.
So accept them or don't, I really don't care. As to the "official" view of the RCC, who cares??
“…We answered to the best of our ability this objection to God's "commanding this first, second, and third thing to be created," when we quoted the words, "He said, and it was done; He commanded, and all things stood fast;" remarking that the immediate Creator, and, as it were, very Maker of the world was the Word, the Son of God; while the Father of the Word, by commanding His own Son--the Word--to create the world, is primarily Creator. And with regard to the creation of the light upon the first day, and of the firmament upon the second, and of the gathering together of the waters that are under the heaven into their several reservoirs on the third (the earth thus causing to sprout forth those (fruits) which are under the control of nature alone, and of the (great) lights and stars upon the fourth, and of aquatic animals upon the fifth, and of land animals and man upon the sixth, we have treated to the best of our ability in our notes upon Genesis, as well as in the foregoing pages, when we found fault with those who, taking the words in their apparent signification, said that the time of six days was occupied in the creation of the world, and quoted the words: "These are the generations of the heavens and of the earth when they were created, in the day that the LORD God made the earth and the heavens."
(Against Celus 6:60 [AD 248])
“For as Adam was told that in the [d]ay [h]e ate of the tree he would die, we know that he did not complete a thousand years. We have perceived, moreover, that the expression, 'The day of the Lord is as a thousand years,' is connected with this subject.”
(Dialog with Typho the Jew chapter 81 [AD 155])
““That, then, we may be taught that the world was originated, and not suppose that God made it in time, prophecy adds: "This is the book of the generation: also of the things in them, when they were created in the day that God made heaven and earth." For the expression "when they were created" intimates an indefinite and dateless production. But the expression "in the day that God made," that is, in and by which God made "all things," and "without which not even one thing was made," points out the activity exerted by the Son. As David says, "This is the day which the Lord hath made; let us be glad and rejoice in it; " that is, in consequence of the knowledge imparted by Him, let us celebrate the divine festival; for the Word that throws light on things hidden, and by whom each created thing came into life and being, is called day.
Clement of Alexandria [208 AD])
“But simultaneously with time the world was made, if in the world's creation change and motion were created, as seems evident from the order of the first six or seven days. For in these days the morning and evening are counted, until, on the sixth day, all things which God then made were finished, and on the seventh the rest of God was mysteriously and sublimely signalized. What kind of days these were it is extremely difficult, or perhaps impossible for us to conceive, and how much more to say!”
St. Augustine (City of God 11:6 [AD 419])
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Just as soon as you substantiate, "But the number 6,000 is believed by many Christian fundamentalists.."
I'm pretty sure you've used the early church fathers argument in many many more posts than I have mentioned your copy and paste stuff.
So accept them or don't, I really don't care.
</div></div>
Do you believe the earth is 6,000 years old?
I have yet to meet an evangelical that does not believe as much.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I'm pretty sure you've used the early church fathers argument in many many more posts than I have mentioned your copy and paste stuff. </div></div>
When I quote the Church Fathers, I quote a primary source. When you quote someone who quotes the Church Fathers out of context, you are, at best, using a secondary source.
See the difference?
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 07:35 PM
Don't recall ever having heard it preached on, much less seen it in any church document.
You are talking and not proving much again.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Barry Morris</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Don't recall ever having heard it preached on, much less seen it in any church document.
You are talking and not proving much again. </div></div>
What do you want me to prove, Barry?
Do you deny some evangelicals believe the earth is 6,000 years old?
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 07:40 PM
Now it's some??
"many Christian fundamentalists"
"I have yet to meet an evangelical that does not believe as much."
Cool!!!
Barry, are you denying some evangelicals believe the earth is 6,000 years old?
" 78% of white evangelicals and fundamentalists said this was the best choice:
God created the Earth and all its creatures in 6 days as described in the book of Genesis 6,000 years ago."
LINK (http://www.defconamerica.org/)
BlueSky
06-30-2008, 10:26 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Not specifically.
But the number 6,000 is believed by many Christian fundamentalists because if you add up the years mentioned when discussing lifespans of certain individuals, especially in the Old Testament, it appears the earth is around 6,000 years old.
You can get that number by reading the OT backwards, so to speak. </div></div>
But isn't that simply counting generations back to Adam?
And aren't there a lot of gaps in those genealogies?
we are talking about the age of the earth. As far as I know, the Bible says NOTHING, zippidee do da about the age of the earth.
Soo, unless you can prove otherwise, please just confess your mistake.Say, "I was wrong". Do it. No qualifications. I know it's hard, but it will feel good.
dancingqueen
06-30-2008, 11:27 PM
the day I see a soonet member admit they are wrong... espesially on the R&P forum is the day I [censored] rainbow but monkies....
Soundbear
06-30-2008, 11:39 PM
The funny part is, we're no longer talking about the age of the world, since no one here actually believes in a young earth.
Soundbear
07-01-2008, 11:23 AM
"How much time should we spend or waste on OT specifics before we lose sight of the forest for the leaves on the trees?"
That's an interesting analogy. I'd say that many want to concentrate on the problems with the leaves of the trees in order to discount the existence of the forest!!
Science enriches religion, and religion gives science its most important dimension. The two have never been the enemies so many people want to believe.
BlueSky
07-01-2008, 11:29 AM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Doc</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluesky</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
You can get that number by reading the OT backwards, so to speak. </div></div>
But isn't that simply counting generations back to Adam?
</div></div>
You can follow year to year up to Cyrus' decree, for which we have an historical reference. This places a very literal "day one" at about 4148 B.C., plus the 2008 years since 1 B.C. puts us at about 6156. </div></div>
You're making some unwarranted assumptions. The practice of biblical genealogists was to often skip over numerous generations, so following the genealogies only helps in studying descendancy, but is no accurate indicator of numbers of generations.
Secondly, you're assuming there is no gap between verse 1 and 2 of the Creation account. Many theories have existed long before the evolutionary theory was concocted by Darwin of a proto-creation that was destroyed by the fall of Satan.
We are very much in the dark regarding any clear biblical data about the age of the earth and/or the year of Adam's existence upon the earth.
Another question I have always had. If Adam and Eve were made as non-dying perfect human specimens, how long did they live before they were expelled from Eden?
Did Adam and Eve have belly buttons?
BlueSky
07-01-2008, 11:33 AM
good one. old, but good.
Soundbear
07-01-2008, 01:07 PM
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: R W G R</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Well??? </div></div>
Did Adam have genitals??
Yes, Barry.
You see, when a man and a woman love each other they lay down in bed and...
...well, umm...let's skip that for now.
Adam had offspring. So yes, he had genitals.
Now, can anyone tell me if Adam had a belly button?
And if he did, why did he have one.
Soundbear
07-01-2008, 02:37 PM
It's the same type of question.
You didn't specify WHEN we should consider these questions.
Did Adam have genitals BEFORE Eve was created??
The answer to your specific question? I doubt you are giving the question it's due seriousness!!
http://www.gracecentered.com/did_Adam_and_Eve_have_belly_buttons_navals.htm
"Such a physical mark would be a visible sign that Adam came through natural childbirth from a woman, when in fact he did NOT"
" In 1944, a subcommittee of the United States House of Representatives Military Committee (chaired by Congressman Durham of the state of North Carolina) refused to authorize a little 30-page booklet titled "Races of Man," that was to be handed out to our soldiers, sailors and airmen fighting in World War II, because this little booklet had a drawing that depicted Adam and Eve with belly buttons! The members of this subcommittee ruled that showing Adam and Eve with navels "would be misleading to gullible American soldiers."
Barry, I don't know!
That's why I'm asking!
What is your view?
My gosh, you are so sensitive right now.
Relax.
Soundbear
07-01-2008, 02:41 PM
Back up.
dancingqueen
07-08-2008, 12:31 AM
From a religious standpoint about the age of the world, I do not believe it to be possble to measure.
Th world was created before God created day and night. I think when God created day and night is when he created time.
as for belly buttons, it is logical to assume they would not have them since it would indicate natural birth. however, I am sure God could have made Adam and Eve to have belly buttons so as to appear natural when they began having their children.
I wonder, in the biblical times, did they have adequate enough methods to know if someone trul was a virgin, or did they just go off of her word?
BlueSky
07-08-2008, 06:17 AM
"Th world was created before God created day and night. I think when God created day and night is when he created time. "
I am not up on physics, but I believe that if matter exists, then time exists.
dancingqueen
07-08-2008, 05:32 PM
I don't think God needs to follow the rules of physics /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
Soundbear
07-08-2008, 05:37 PM
He INVENTED physics.
Nothing inside a thing can create that thing.
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