ASI

[Macs II]

It looks like the Union already has it's hands full..as the company wants to eliminate the letters of agreement signed previously between the company and the union. It's interesting to see what the outcome is .

[kodak57]

u make me laugh..................

[Macs II]

we'll see

[kodak57]

ya we will,u still make me laugh..........lol.....you would be a great person to tell a rumor too......we thought fires spread fast.........lol..Get the facts first before you speak,oh but i bet you did.........sorry...LMFAO!!!!!!!!

[Macs II]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">ya we will,u still make me laugh..........lol.....you would be a great person to tell a rumor too......we thought fires spread fast.........lol..Get the facts first before you speak,oh but i bet you did.........sorry...LMFAO!!!!!!!! </div></div>

so your saying the local newspapers are writing rumors ?

[KWB]

I'd just leave ASI and get a job elsewere

[riggs]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Macs</div><div class="ubbcode-body">It looks like the Union already has it's hands full..as the company wants to eliminate the letters of agreement signed previously between the company and the union. It's interesting to see what the outcome is . </div></div>

The company claims these letters of agreement have hurt the companies performance.That statement was made after a estimated billion dollars in profits since the last contract.

[GRUMPY]

It always the same every contract each side asks for the moon. I'd give the upper hand to the company after all how much fight can a jelly fish put up?

[riggs]

I believe the strike mandate vote is july 2nd so we'll have our answer shortly.

[GRUMPY]

These votes are all the same every time with a strong vote for strike action, I've yet to see one that wasn't . It's all part of the game.

[GRUMPY]

Just a word of advice after going through the last strike, take everything with a grain of salt from BOTH the company and the union as they are both liars and neither truly care about the worker. The company wants your labour for as cheap as possible and the union wants your dues. The last strike I was a firm union member till I caught the area rep in a bald face lie and then the lights went on for me.

[KDawg]

Essar is a multi-national company with $billions in assets and revenues.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Essar Global Chairman, Shashi Ruia said his company is looking forward to expanding operations into North America. “Our investment in Minnesota Steel is exciting as it gives us a cornerstone in the North American market. From this we will further expand our global steel business,” he said.</div></div>

link (http://www.azom.com/details.asp?newsID=8275)

I'd say they're the ones holding the cards.

[kodak57]

yes i am......

[Ultra54]

The company always has the money but they don't hold the cards. The worker holds the cards. What type of idiot would invest billions in the North American steel market only to piss it away over something so rediculous. It's the same as when you go buy a car, the seller always starts high and you meet somewhere in the middle. Its all part of the game and if you bother to get into it this early in the game then fine, have fun.

[Huggy85]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: grumpy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">These votes are all the same every time with a strong vote for strike action, I've yet to see one that wasn't . It's all part of the game. </div></div>

Correct. These strike votes are merely a formality. Without a strike vote, the union has no power in negotiations, you'll never see a strike mandate vote that does no give an overwhelming approval for a strike.

Without a pro-strike vote, the company has no motivation to negotiate with the union

[GRUMPY]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultra54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The company always has the money but they don't hold the cards. The worker holds the cards. What type of idiot would invest billions in the North American steel market only to piss it away over something so rediculous. It's the same as when you go buy a car, the seller always starts high and you meet somewhere in the middle. Its all part of the game and if you bother to get into it this early in the game then fine, have fun. </div></div>

you never know they might just want to prove something, we'll have to wait and see.

[riggs]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultra54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> The company always has the money but they don't hold the cards. The worker holds the cards. What type of idiot would invest billions in the North American steel market only to piss it away over something so rediculous. It's the same as when you go buy a car, the seller always starts high and you meet somewhere in the middle. Its all part of the game and if you bother to get into it this early in the game then fine, have fun. </div></div>

Based on that investment I can't see them wanting a labour dispute.It's just a case of the company wanting to strike first as they know we'll be after a healthy contract based on the profits earned.

But as Grumpy says we'll just have to wait and see.

[GRUMPY]

The thing to remember we are in a tiny little town out in the boonies so how the heck do we know whats actually going on? The deciding factors could be something that we are totally unaware of.

[kodak57]

yes we will...i doubt if the new owners are not even at the bargaining table you are right that it would be stupid to start your new business off with a strike.Myself,i think its Denis Turcotte that is behind this signing letters of agreements again just to bog down talks and come in at the last minute with a crappy offer and a signing bonus,and we will jump at it,like the last,but hopefully we have learned from last contract and will not jump at any offer.Oh just for the record,for the people that are going to say,"what about the 10,000$?",well that we were going to get anyway they just gave it to us 6 months early.I hope we dont go on strike but i and alot of others are preparing for it,like it or not,and for those who dont like it...TFB!!.We have alot to address including our retired members,they as well as the present have made this whole company possible.

[riggs]

I'm not sure how many years of negotiations they want to wipe out with the elimination of the letters of agreements but I'm sure it far too much.

Alot of work and effort went into these agreements and they were made for reasons to solve problems.Simply talk to the older members and retirees and they'll tell you what life was like before some of these agreements were put into place.

your right Steve....we need to be patient and not jump at the first offer

[riggs]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: grumpy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The thing to remember we are in a tiny little town out in the boonies so how the heck do we know whats actually going on? The deciding factors could be something that we are totally unaware of. </div></div>

I've thought of that to Grumpy....we need to think on the scale of a global market.

[GRUMPY]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: steve</div><div class="ubbcode-body">.We have alot to address including our retired members,they as well as the present have made this whole company possible. </div></div>

Well theres an outside chance that retirees will even be mentioned as the Union took some heat over it the last time (but not enough). Everyone was mad at the company but it's the unions job to push for retirees not the company's to offer out of the goodness of their heart. The retirees that I feel for the most are the old ones who have been gone 25 or more years. It's a sad state of affairs where you'd make more on welfare than you'd on a full pension.They're being punished for beating the odds and not dieing 18 months after they retired.

[Sooboy33]

When I retired 16 years ago,they gave me $1200 a month.
At 65 they took my supplement and gave me $900 and some change.
16 years later,I still get the $900 a month.
Local 2251 never told me that they would fight for me to get my Index back.But yes they did get all their Bonuses.
I hope that all the 2251 officers will retire soon without an Indexed Pension,and I`ll look forward seeing them 16 years from now.That time I`ll be 90 but i`ll wait just to see them enjoy their great pension.I also strongly believe that the Indexed pensions would have not been the cause of ASI to not to be in bussiness today.

[Hans]

Letters of agreement are odd to me. I was always under the impression they were only valid for the duration of the collective agreement?
I was once told at a union meeting letters of agreement do not necessarily get published in a collective agreement, and their might be even some we never even see. That sounded kinda odd to me...

[Macs II]

Now that the voting is over and there is a strike mandate ...I was talking to couple of people who work at the plant today ..and they said they were pretty happy with the wages and so on but if anything was taken away they would be ready to walk out....but I got the feeling that they weren't asking too much either ..more like just leave it the way it is ...I don't know if that is just the opinion of few or more .

[The 6th Member Of AC/DC]

I think its the opinion of most of us there...

[kodak57]

the stumbling block is going to be article regarding senority,this is the corner stone of any union,the company want to eliminate lines of progression,"pool jobs" and rid itself of its injured workers.Article 7:01 is worth striking over.Oh by the way essar didnt put much of its own money,they used the money we had in the bank,mortgaged us essar maybe put in 500million of their own and id bet it wasnt even close to that.

[Ultra54]

I am of that opinion. I attended the union meeting lastnight. The thing we are saying is that we have helped this company earn record profits and we won't give back a thing. Now what the company will do is come back with rediculous damands as they have so that we will be happy with a similar deal we have now. Its an elaborate dance between the union and the company and nothing happens until the last 24hrs. Like last time they made demands and and in the end made it seam like they were giving a 10,000 dollar signing bonus when infact that was our money all along through profit sharing. We were set to get it a few months later is all but they get the public behind them with this tactic. Total propaganda. What the union might do also as they have in the past is paint the company in a bad light so that when they come back with crumb they can say,"look we we got from the big bad giant, a crumb" and we think they are great.

[Ultra54]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">rid itself of its injured workers </div></div>
If they got tuff on that you wouldn't believe the amount of magic pills that would be taken inorder to make the sick better agian.
<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Oh by the way essar didnt put much of its own money,they used the money we had in the bank,mortgaged us essar maybe put in 500million of their own and id bet it wasnt even close to that.
</div></div> I can't believe the spineless government will allow this crap to happen. They will no doubt borrow all the money in order to finace the massive expansion of Algoma instead of their own. They will suck up as much bread from the government as they can.

[Shaggy]

O.K. - I see it this way. The company is making record profits and the talk is steel prices are going up again.
The company, like last time is thinking "the employees are going to want a bigger piece of the pie, how do we counter those demands".
The answer is to make a bunch of ridiculous demands to take the focus off of the profits, wages or any kind of improvements to the contract. Now, like last time, they will wait until the eleventh hour and pull back on their demands. The emloyees, relieved that they are retaining some of their basic rights, will accept the contract with minimal gains.

I think the reality is that all most employees want is a fair and balanced contract. I just wish that could be obtained in a mature manner without all the games.

[WingNut]

[quote=Ultra54] <div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">rid itself of its injured workers </div></div>
If they got tuff on that you wouldn't believe the amount of magic pills that would be taken inorder to make the sick better agian.

They should patent that cure. Seemed to work about 6 yrs ago when the scammers suddenly got better. We used to say it was a miracle cure!

[adigirl]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Shaggy</div><div class="ubbcode-body">O.K. - I see it this way. The company is making record profits and the talk is steel prices are going up again.
The company, like last time is thinking "the employees are going to want a bigger piece of the pie, how do we counter those demands".
The answer is to make a bunch of ridiculous demands to take the focus off of the profits, wages or any kind of improvements to the contract. Now, like last time, they will wait until the eleventh hour and pull back on their demands. The emloyees, relieved that they are retaining some of their basic rights, will accept the contract with minimal gains.

I think the reality is that all most employees want is a fair and balanced contract. I just wish that could be obtained in a mature manner without all the games. </div></div>

That is exactly what they did at Tenaris. It was ridiculous.

I agree with Hans. It is very odd that all letters of agreement are not open knowledge and that contracts are voted on and settled without workers even knowing what those letters are. That should not be happening.

[Reckidecky]

I hope none of you get hurt at work! Maybe you would see just how bad the system really works these days. Do you think ASI will take care of you? Did anyone know WSIB has stakeholders and is not publically owned. Oh and guess who the stakeholders are, all the companies who fund the insurance policy!! Conflict of interest no? It is pathetic really!!
Do you honestly believe WSIB is there to take care of you if you get hurt? Those days are long gone! All you can do is take care of yourself on the job and hope to not get hurt, because if you do you are on your own, fighting against a bureaucracy for your basic human rights.
There are always people who take advantage of the systems in place, however, if faking an injury, they are really of sound mind and body, and manage to manipulate the system far better than someone who is legitimately hurt, (it is extremely difficult to think straight when your in alot of pain)
They are the ones whom you can thank after you have been hurt... for literally making your life miserable!!

[KWB]

Employees have never had it so good,want a few months off to go salmon fishing (STRESS) and boy do the same people use that one.
Wife had a baby,Stress need a few months off
Wife left me (a/c too much DOPE)Stress need 3 months off
Just don't feel like working july & aug "Stress"
---------------------------------------------------------
So go on strike for 6 months
---------------------------------------------------------
99% of the workers at ASI do a great job but that same 1% can drag a dept down

[tippikitty]

Not everyone want to go on strike.

[riggs]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Ultra54</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> I am of that opinion. I attended the union meeting lastnight. The thing we are saying is that we have helped this company earn record profits and we won't give back a thing. Now what the company will do is come back with rediculous damands as they have so that we will be happy with a similar deal we have now. Its an elaborate dance between the union and the company and nothing happens until the last 24hrs. Like last time they made demands and and in the end made it seam like they were giving a 10,000 dollar signing bonus when infact that was our money all along through profit sharing. We were set to get it a few months later is all but they get the public behind them with this tactic. Total propaganda. What the union might do also as they have in the past is paint the company in a bad light so that when they come back with crumb they can say,"look we we got from the big bad giant, a crumb" and we think they are great. </div></div>

The monetary in the last contract was nothing to mention like you say.I believe the union was wrong in putting the $10,000 as the top item on their list.I told people to overlook that point for the same reasons as you.When you eliminate that point we got a nominal raise and they made record profits.I will say we established good language in the last contract,unfortunatly the company has broke many of those agreements, lost in arbitration and has become a repeat offender.

Hopefully we don't jump all over the first offer as I'm sure they have another in the event we reject.

[tippikitty]

Hey riggs....how you doing?

[Huggy85]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Reckidecky</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I hope none of you get hurt at work! Maybe you would see just how bad the system really works these days. Do you think ASI will take care of you? Did anyone know WSIB has stakeholders and is not publically owned. Oh and guess who the stakeholders are, all the companies who fund the insurance policy!! Conflict of interest no? It is pathetic really!!
Do you honestly believe WSIB is there to take care of you if you get hurt? Those days are long gone! All you can do is take care of yourself on the job and hope to not get hurt, because if you do you are on your own, fighting against a bureaucracy for your basic human rights.
There are always people who take advantage of the systems in place, however, if faking an injury, they are really of sound mind and body, and manage to manipulate the system far better than someone who is legitimately hurt, (it is extremely difficult to think straight when your in alot of pain)
They are the ones whom you can thank after you have been hurt... for literally making your life miserable!! </div></div>

WSIB is not controlled by the companies. It is an Ontario Government Agency. It is funded by the companies and the government sets the rates that they must pay into the fund. The higher the accident rate, the more the company pays. Thus, safe workplaces pay less into the fund.

http://www.ufcw12r24.ca/wsib1.html

I personally am very thankful for WSIB. They treated me very well and had it not been for them, I'd have been bankrupt and destitute by now. Instead, I was paid a good income and had my college tuition and expenses paid for for three years.

Usually (emphasis on usually...no system is perfect), legitimate claims are treated fairly by WSIB.

[riggs]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: *~TippiKitty~*</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Hey riggs....how you doing? </div></div>

Everythings good Tippsy....smile

How's the old man holding up?

[tippikitty]

He's still alive. I haven't killed him yet. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/lol.gif

[Reckidecky]

I somewhat disagree with ya there huggy...just because it is a government agency does not mean they are a publicly owned and funded office...they have an obligation to there shareholders...its shareholders are the employers...if I were to read through the hours and hours of WSIB pages and information on there site I would post were you could read it...nonetheless...they are not obligated to the injured worker...Ever had an insurance company you tried to make a claim through ,auto or home??? Same concept...I would agree with the emphasis on "usually" I suppose, but my experience wasn't exactly heartwarming.

[Reckidecky]

Oh... and Grumpy...a jellyfish killed the crocdile hunter!