The Devils greatest trick

[1337]

Wouldn't it be odd if religion was the Devils greatest trick? Creating different religions for us to fight over and fight for? Causing wars and millions of deaths?

What happens if all your beleifs are wrong? If there is a creator and you pissed him off for beleiving in the wrong thing?

[Larimar]

never know.

any religious leaders-like gurus, buddha, jesus ever actually say "start a religion"? or did they all just say spread the word of god?

[The Berean]

Jumba, you nailed it.

Religion IS the devils greatest trick. Hoping through life that following a set of rules and hoping you get them right is enough, or belonging to the right group, or hoping that what you understand is good enough to get you into heaven.

[1337]

Well, according to most religions i'm going to hell.

I do beleive in a creator, but i don't beleive anything in the bible! In any bible.

Its kind of sad, but its just the way I feel.

[KDawg]

I think one of the devil's greatest tricks has been to convince people he doesn't exist, or at least is only a caricature with red horns and a pitchfork.

[Larimar]

No one ever explains how that "quote" actually makes any sense. Tricking ppl to not believing in you-how would that give you any power at all? instead of getting ppl to fear you and take notice of you-you are having ppl turn their backs on you and face God Only. why on earth would God want us to give all our fears and acknowledgement to the devil? wouldnt god rather we knew "he" (God) made the judgements and choices? How can it be such a great trick if people don't believe in the devil? Certainly you can't assume because someone doesn't believe in a devil they are easily pursuaded by him? it's untrue-as ppl will still believe in evil-and they will know right from wrong if good and god followers anyways-what need have they for a devil? why do some christians act as though he should be looked upon as though he were great? I don't get it-why would god want us to look at the devil at all? When there's a bully at school when I was younger -you get told to ignore them-turn the other cheek..you don't have to take note of them and fight back or anything-so what good does it do to acknowledge and give attention to a devil? I don't personally believe in hell or a devil-to each his/her own-but i'm curious why Christians believe it's a trick.

[KDawg]

First off, the bible says Satan is a real being, so I believe it. Actually all you have to do is look at the world that's falling apart around you.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> Tricking ppl to not believing in you-how would that give you any power at all?</div></div>
So then Satan can keep on convincing, and people can keep on believing that when bad things happen, it's all God's fault. This is Satan's MO.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> wouldnt god rather we knew "he" (God) made the judgements and choices?</div></div>
People make their own choices. If I stick a needle in my arm, that's my choice -- it's not God's fault.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> How can it be such a great trick if people don't believe in the devil? </div></div>
See my first response.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body"> why do some christians act as though he should be looked upon as though he were great?</div></div>
Not great, but certainly powerful.

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I don't get it-why would god want us to look at the devil at all? When there's a bully at school when I was younger -you get told to ignore them-turn the other cheek..you don't have to take note of them and fight back or anything-so what good does it do to acknowledge and give attention to a devil? </div></div>
God doesn't want you to look at or give attention to the devil. On the contrary, He warns us to stay away.

[Larimar]

I didn't mean he makes our choices for us-i meant god is the final judgement -not the devil by any means.

I don't believe that if you don't believe in the devil-you are convinced of anything evil- A person still knows right from wrong-their morals don't change due to believing in an entity or not. Same goes for god-athiests are not bad- there may be som eof the most loving, giving ppl who don't believe in god-I don't think that really makes you act any way..so what do you mean? I don't believe in the devil so he can trick me into murder? i dooont think so dude. /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif I don't believe in the devil and I don't blame god for bad things-I blame human beings. the evil entities are right here with us-in the forms of osama bin ladens and hitlers-they are the murderers and the child rapests.. I'd never blame God for the actions of another soul-free will was given for a reason. I don't think the devil has anything to do with how someone acts. the whole "the devil made me do it" to me is a cop out-b.c you aren't taking responsibility for your actions. anyways-just my opinion tho. i respect ppl who believe in the devil-but it's not exactly my cuppa tea. I do believe in evil-just not in the same concept Christians would.

but all in all-i think the quote-the devils greatest trick is to make ppl believe that he doesnt exist"-is just a witty saying-and a saying never proves anything to be true tho. just a way to make ppl who do believe feel better about it-and to look at others who don't as gullable and under the devils grasp-i think it's silly tho to be honest.-if you know what i'm saying. it's hard to explain thing son boards-well for me it is.

[bluekrissyspikes]

i don't know why christian people think they are more powerful than anyone else...is it because you read the bible and what it says makes you feel empowered? the bible is just a book, many religions have them.. none of them are really written by the god that the people beleive goes with the book..it's all written by men.. men who want you to fallow thier rules and beleive what they tell you to beleive, weither it is for their own personal power trip or weither they think that they are somehow helping out mankind...who knows... i don't see why anyone would want to fallow set rules of a religion that has caused so much pain and war to the people of this world that they supposably care so much about.. nor do i understand why so much faith is put into a book when so much of the writting in it does not fit our society when science has proven so much of it imposible... i mean Chris angel can walk on water, but does that make him special? not really.. interesting maybe, but not so special. besides if you are a christian then you have to believe in the devil cause the bible tells you to... just like it tells you that gays are evil... i mean really...not bashing christianity, but in my pov most of what is in the bible are beleifs that are so outdated that most people can't even relate to them anymore.. and as for catholisism.. well it you beleive in that then we are all going to hell, aren't we? since almost everything is sin....

[The Berean]

Well, bluekrissyspikes, youve made about 47 points.
Any you care to discuss??

[Larimar]

I don't min dher point of view or beliefs-to each his/her own and there's even som epoints made that i'll agree with-however-let's not be silly-Cris Angel is a magician and illusionist-he doesn't walk on water he walks on glass and does tricks. Jesus and other spiritual leaders didn't perform illusions-Cris admits that what he does isn't real.

[bluekrissyspikes]

true enough

[1337]

I like the point that the books/bibles are written by men.

If you understood the way these "MEN" were, you could probably understand most of the stuff is made up.

I'm going to take the time to read King James version of the bible so I can talk about it better.

But, a man so powerful as he was, don't you think he had some influence on how the bible was prepared for the reason of manipulation?

[Larimar]

Jumba, yes King james version edited a lot out of the bible. which is ashame-the original bible has a lot about reincarnation and actually never says anything about psychics or mediums or witches-of todays standards-wicca that is.. Wicca wasn't a religion back then at all it's fairly new. Witch actually reffered to the fairytale creatures-and pagans werent really what we'd think of today, back then..I dunno there's a lot that's changed. I read one exactly site which told the hebrew version and then the king james version-i wish I still had a hold of it , but it was saying how it now says do not seek mediums and seers or something to that affect..when the original one says "do not seek out diviners of the clouds" who are they ? our fine weather men and woman..nothing to do with mediums at all. the bible was against predicting the weather! lol


I love studying the bible tho-I know it fairy well-as I have about 5 bibles , I think all different versions which are very very old-passed down the generations

[bluekrissyspikes]

that is also a very good poind, dreamspirit... so many different takes on the interpretation can be made to totally change the meaning of everything... and there is no way to know what is correct and what is not.. i am not really for or against any religions, i just can't understand why people would fallow a book so closely like they do.. i mean, i beleive in a higher power, and whatever you want to call it, creator, god, saviour, godesse, the power of life, or any of the hundreds of other possible names, it is all the same to me, and i know in my heart what is right and wrong, and i try to do what is right based on that, not on rules that were written thousands of years ago, by who knows who really.... IMO it is better to beleive in something then to beleive in nothing, and i don't think that this higher power will be so caught up in the details.. i try to keep an open mind, so i hope you all are doing the same. several years ago a friend brought me into a christian church and i went with her twice a week for quite some time, even got chrisened, (although my beleifs then were not too different than they are now, only thought of the higher power as god rather than as what i currently do), i was trying to learn as much as i could about christianity, and it just didn't make sense to me.. the minister seemed to spend alot of time contradicting himself and went on one day to try to convince me that a member of my family was evil for being gay..?What?..and started quoting scripture to prove it to me.. it totally made me need to rethink my beleifs, along with a few other things....

[bluekrissyspikes]

not sure what the point of all that was...i guess my main question at the moment is... what draws you to put so much blind faith into something like the bible, and just beleive everything it says, just because it tells you to?

[Boondock]

Pfft blaming some dude with horns and a pointy tail for the mis-doings of man is about as sane as blaming Mr T.

[Larimar]

Krissy-Who is the you u speak of? I don't follow the bible so I can't answer ...

[Koss]

Does anyone else think it's strange that we assume that our God is testing us to pick the right religion and the devil is trying to trick us into the wrong one. Life isn't a board game.

To me it makes more sense to think the meaning of life is the pursuit of peace. Religion seems like a cop-out for those who really don't want to explore their spiritual side. Just follow the rules on the back of the box and you'll win the game.

[The Berean]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DreamSpirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jumba, yes King james version edited a lot out of the bible. which is ashame-the original bible has a lot about reincarnation and actually never says anything about psychics or mediums or witches-of todays standards-wicca that is.. Wicca wasn't a religion back then at all it's fairly new. Witch actually reffered to the fairytale creatures-and pagans werent really what we'd think of today, back then..I dunno there's a lot that's changed. I read one exactly site which told the hebrew version and then the king james version-i wish I still had a hold of it , but it was saying how it now says do not seek mediums and seers or something to that affect..when the original one says "do not seek out diviners of the clouds" who are they ? our fine weather men and woman..nothing to do with mediums at all. the bible was against predicting the weather! lol


I love studying the bible tho-I know it fairy well-as I have about 5 bibles , I think all different versions which are very very old-passed down the generations </div></div>

"I love studying the bible"

What a load.

"The King James version edisted a lot out of the bible.." Really. Lets discuss your sources for that tripe. You must know what has been removed to be able to state that.

Tell us about it.

[Larimar]

"I love studying the bible"

"What a load."

why do u judge me?
I've taken christian beliefs since I was a toddler-i have at least 6 bibles-different versions and years I've read. and taken courses on it. Why is it so hard to believe someone has read and learned about religion but doesn't agree with it?

The rest of my post had nothing to do with what i'd studied-more so what I had learned from reading a site online-and I'd already stated very clearly that it was an unknown sourse. -It was given for food for thought-as the hebrew bible did have different words then what we use today. For example-mediums -is in a lot of bibles now.. they didn't even use that word back then.(I mean if you are supposed to translate word for word-then they should do that) Also witches weren't a religion back when Jesus walked the earth-) the only witches there were -were fairytale kind-and perhaps pagans came close to wicca. These are my own opinions-i'm not backing them up with proof-ppl can do their own research.

[KDawg]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DreamSpirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body">
I've taken christian beliefs since I was a toddler-i have at least 6 bibles-different versions and years I've read. and taken courses on it. Why is it so hard to believe someone has read and learned about religion but doesn't agree with it? </div></div>
What you say directly contradicts what's in the Bible...that's why. You say:


<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">the original bible has a lot about reincarnation and actually never says anything about psychics or mediums or witches-of todays standards-wicca that is.. Wicca wasn't a religion back then at all it's fairly new. Witch actually reffered to the fairytale creatures-and pagans werent really what we'd think of today, back then..I dunno there's a lot that's changed. </div></div>

Here are 3 excerpts from the Bible:

1 Chronicles 10:13
So Saul died for his unfaithfulness which he had committed against the LORD, because he did not keep the word of the LORD, and also because he consulted a medium for guidance.

2 Chronicles 33:6
Also he caused his sons to pass through the fire in the Valley of the Son of Hinnom; he practiced soothsaying, used witchcraft and sorcery, and consulted mediums and spiritists. He did much evil in the sight of the LORD, to provoke Him to anger.

Isaiah 19:3
The spirit of Egypt will fail in its midst;
I will destroy their counsel,
And they will consult the idols and the charmers,
The mediums and the sorcerers.

DS, which Bible are you talking about?

[Larimar]

I didn't say I "agreeeed" with the bible lmao and I didn't say i knew all about it-You can enjoy hearing about things and reading something without taking it all in as"the" "word"-I was trying to say mediumship- seems to b a pretty new word being used now-it wasn't used back then-i will-for the sake of -learning and fun-tell u what words my bibles use. Since you asked what bibles.




for Isaiah 19:3
my bible does not say medium-it only states wizards, idols, and charmers..I don't know any wizards, charmers I don't know any, and I certainly don't worship idols.
this is from "the holy bible containing the old and new testaments: translated out of the original tongues: and with the former translations diligently compared and revised-1917"

my chronicles2 33:6- does not say mediums either-it says witchcraft , sorcery, and wizards-but not mediumship or soothsaying. (sorry.-this bible i looked in has no date but has written on it-To (name) love aunty-1964- )and surprisingly it is a kJ version that mentions no mediums. interesting how translations keep coming up with different words isn't it?

i checked all of them-and none state medium-the first on eyou posted stated familiar spirit though-but one cannot assume this woman was a medium-as evil people also try to do that..doesn't make it the same thing though. It's just guessing what kind of a person she was, and why she contacted the dead-I know of satanists now days who contactthe dead too-I wouldnt touch them with a 10 foot pole-so How can we judge what she was when the bible doesnt truly say what she is-the newer bibles do say medium-that's all i'm saying. I'm saying we can't truly know unless we have the original and we don't-at least i dont
the first quote you gave "1 Chronicles 10:13"
I checked my 1909 bible-none say medium that I have.. i also have a jerusalem bible-it is interesting too-bigger it seems lol. nice for my eyes haha
so, what are your sources?

[Larimar]

btw-i'm not a fanatic soi'm not saying anything i say is fact-It's opnion and some lil differences my bibles have that I believe make a huge difference in the meanings-to each-his/her own. I am not saying you are wrong , I'm just discussing it as a way to learn.

[bluekrissyspikes]

yes.. translation is a huge problem... the churches over time have changed the meaning of so many thing because of their inability to translate properly...i also know alot was changed earlier this century about the witchs and stuff, because people feared anyone who didn't beleive what they did..and if they didnt understand it, well then, it was evil.... the bible says an eye for an eye, so why are wiccans and pagans not burning christians at the stake for being different then them?

[The Berean]

"the bible says an eye for an eye"

And what does that mean in the context of where it is found??

[Larimar]

an eye for an eye - was the laws of the old Tes-isn't it?
Back before Jesus was born there were a lot of silly rules-my son died in the house you built-I get to kill your son. Yes laws like this existed in some places long ago-I took this in college (Law) but have no memory as to the years or places. Maybe someone knows?
Anyways, I would think the eye for an eye was that if you commited a crime you were punished.
The accused at salem witch trials and obviously ones before this time were wrongful acts on innocent people-the eye for an eye would probably want the persecuters hung as well. If they knew.
But when Jesus came he said turn the other cheek. and so I would think eye for an eye became null and void. jmho

[The Berean]

Just some excerpts from DS and Krissy. I really dont expect you guys to defend anything, because you really dont know what you are talking about.

"...most of what is in the bible are beleifs that are so outdated that most people can't even relate to them anymore.."

Really? lIke what for instance??

"I love studying the bible tho-I know it fairy well-as I have about 5 bibles... "

Fairy is a good word here. Imaginary.

"..an eye for an eye - was the laws of the old Tes..."

Dont you know for sure?? It was a call for fairness in judgement, not a licence to take vengence. Not what you thought.

But then, "I don't follow the bible so I can't answer ... "
Really? Which is it DS, "I know it fairly well" or "I dont follow.."

And I wish you would follow up on this, ""The King James version edisted a lot out of the bible.." What exactly was left out??

And you say "Why do you judge me?" and "Why is it so hard to believe someone has read and learned about religion but doesn't agree with it?"

Its not hard to believe that you dont believe. Its just impossible to believe that you actually LEARNED anything about what the bible actually says.

And krissy says "the churches over time have changed the meaning of so many thing because of their inability to translate properly."

Really?? How do you know that?? How is the bible studied?? How are ancient texts handled.

[Larimar]

"I love studying the bible tho-I know it fairy well-as I have about 5 bibles... "

Fairy is a good word here. Imaginary"
very mature-it's a typo.
I can understand a concept and not a gree with it. I'v eread and understood Wicca too-but I don't agree with it. Just b.c you "think" you know more doesn't make it so. I have a hard time getting my thoughts out on paper and in typing-doesn't mean that you know more than I do, and it doesn't mean I know more than you do either-it wasn't said as a competition. It was said to show that i have read different translations and know fairly well the differences. I understand the concept of christianity-I said "fairly" well-as I don't claim to know it all. Perhaps you do-but I do not., Why do you make such a fuss over the fact that someone else grew up christian, studied it and doesn't believe in all of it? If it offends you, then don't read my posts. I don't mind. But to claim you know what I like and to know what i know-is a direct violation of your own bibles guidelines. thou shall not judge? was that it? what the heck are u doing? why on earth do you think i havn't learned anything-where are your facts?
what makes you the authority over the bible to claim such nonsense?

It will be awful hard for you to proove I learned nothing from the bible-only that I do not follow it.

[Larimar]

what was taken out? obviously words like wizards were as you used the word medium. So yes some versions take out words and add new ones to update to the times. But what if the bible meant wizards ? not medium, not soothsayer and not fortune teller? what if it meant wizard as many very old bibles state?-to change a word, a single word(as time passes)-can change the whole meaning. or do you denie that?

[The Berean]

"i have read different translations and know fairly well the differences"

This shows exactly what Im talking about: where did the translations come from?? You dont know, and worse dont care.


"Why do you make such a fuss over the fact that someone else grew up christian, studied it and doesn't believe in all of it?"


Grew up Christian?? Theres the basic problem. You think Christianity is a religion. Its not. Its a relationship. With God. For every rule or regulation or ritual you think one must go threough or believe in, there is argument about exactly what the rule or regulation means or just exactly how carefully one must perform the ritual. And suppose you get it wrong?? Suppose your finite mind cant quite comprehend exactly what you must believe about the eternal Almighty God?? Are you doomed??

No. The true believer submits to God, becomes His child, and then seeks to know Him better.

Believe it or dont.

[Larimar]

I won't argue with you-you seem to think you know me when you don't. You've already made many claims about what i know before asking. So I'll leave you to it then!

[The Berean]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DreamSpirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body">what was taken out? obviously words like wizards were as you used the word medium. So yes some versions take out words and add new ones to update to the times. But what if the bible meant wizards ? not medium, not soothsayer and not fortune teller? what if it meant wizard as many very old bibles state?-to change a word, a single word(as time passes)-can change the whole meaning. or do you denie that? </div></div>

Whats the point??

Whether mediums or wizards or necromancers or soothsayers or fortune tellers, STAY AWAY FROM THEM!!!! God doesnt want us to look to anyone else for truth. Because He knows no one else has it.

[Larimar]

but prophets of jesus times were "okay" to seek truth from? YES ABSOLUTELY EACH WORD is important!!! medium is NOT a wizard or a witch no more then a christian is a buddhist!! but whatever again, i wont argue this is my last post here to u. it would seem there will never be an open mind from you that translations can change a meaning obviously. I've never argued mediumship was good under the christian values-i only said they are not wizards and the words are changed so much, so my real question would be what does the hebrew say? how different is it then?

questions u may not wantto know. who knows

[The Berean]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DreamSpirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body">I won't argue with you-you seem to think you know me when you don't. You've already made many claims about what i know before asking. So I'll leave you to it then!

</div></div>

You have made claims about changes to the bible, without any backup. You claim to have studied it.

Dont make staements like that and I wont respond. Make blanket biased unsuppoerted claims and I will respond.

[KDawg]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: DreamSpirit</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Jumba, yes King james version edited a lot out of the bible. which is ashame-the original bible has a lot about reincarnation and....</div></div>

Which original bible, and where and in what context does it talk about reincarnation?

[Larimar]

Is it your belief the devil exists? you may say "the devil exists" is there actual physical proof of this? no.
Do I have physical proof of my claims? no-It's my belief after reading a lot of historians speculations. Some say yes they think there's parts missing, others will say no. Right now I tend to agree with the ones who say yes as the book written in its original language was translated many times by those in power -just my opinion tho ok? just my opinion..just as the devil exists is your opinion. to each his/her own. I don't have any proof to show you unless you want to read and research and come to ur own conclusion.

[KDawg]

Your comparing trying to prove Satan's existence to proving the existence of certain passages in a book we can all reference?

You said, "the original bible has a lot about reincarnation and...." Well, if that's true, then chapter and verse please.

You can't just keep making statements (like the one above) and then spurt and sputter when someone asks for a reference.

[Larimar]

I was merely corecting myself. Some times ppl state their beliefs as fact (as i compared the devil to any other belief yes-) . And comparing your beliefs to this-is the same thing. It's a belief that you have no proof of. I was merely admitting to a mistake in stating it so suredly. Not many people will admit to making mistakes, but I do. I just don't think I've done anything that any one else hasn't done on this site. Stating the devil exists is the same thing-indeed it is..as the bible offer no proof to me..I could say to you also-where's your proof? you say the bible.(and i laugh at that proof).and I say my proof is in the historeans writings and research(in real time evidence, and you laugh at that too). I know the writings isn't proof to you-s the bible is not proof to me (understand the point i'm making now? )and so I correct my statement and say it's merely my opinion. do you understand now? I made an error in the way I spoke. -I don't know about yourself, but i'm only human. I'm allowed to have an error and correct it-
so again, i opologize if what I said was wrong to you-so I'll say it again in a proper way-I "believe" from reserach i've read
that there's been some text missing from our bibles we read today.-JMH opinion(don't worry i'll remember to put a disclaimer on my opinions in the future /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/wink.gif
but it doesn't matter if you don't. I really don't care.

If you really are interested in reading about the speculations and historeans who talk about it maybe I can find some online which discusses it-but as for the researchers in person-I cannot give them to u...

[KDawg]

OK, good. We're on the same page then. Opinions do not equal facts.

I know I can't prove Satan exists to you, but I can say look at the evidence in the book of Job 1:7. Whether you accept that or not is beside the point, but it's got more teeth than saying "Satan exists because I think he does," right?

[Larimar]

yes i can agree with you /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

I just like reading about alternative theories I suppose. Have you heard the ones that talk about satan the angel not being the same as some of the devil references we read in the bible? I forget where I read that, but I am going to look it up on google to see what it was I am thinking of.

[bluekrissyspikes]

it wasn't very nice of you guys to attack DS like that...we are entitled to our opinions as well, and it is not reasonable to expect her to have some ancient bible in front of her to translate differences to you.....i will do some research and see what i can find to back up her point...you seem to be under the impression that people with different beleifs from you are not welcome here or something... perhaps you should go relax and have a bubble bath or something...no need to get all worked up about.... keeping an open mind is an important quality...right? oh and christianity, to me, is merely a religion, a set of rules and traditions laid out for you to fallow, basically saying, beleive this because this is how we tell you things are(were)... spirituality is different than religion, as i know i am a very spiritual person, and have a relationship with my higher power, without the need to label myself as a christian...i just beleive what makes sense and love god on my own terms...like for instance, to me god is female, because women are generally gentler, more creative, loving and more into making things work out, and men are more aggresive, and short tempered....

[The Berean]

BlueKrissy, everyone is entitled to their opinion. But if she says "This book, that I don't believe in, says this" and then proceeds to give an opinion which bears no relationship to what that book actually says AND wont try to back up what she says, then she can expect someone to ask where exactly she got that information.

So fine, I understand that she wants to keep her opinion. Thats cool. Just remember what I said.

BTW, BKS. you said, "..to me god is female, because women are generally gentler, more creative, loving.." God is neither male nor female nor a human being. As a little test of your theory about women, I suggest the next time you are at the mall, if you see a woman with a little kid, go and slap the kid upside the head, and you will get an update from momma on gentler and loving, and maybe even creative!!

[Larimar]

My personal belief is that God is an energy(or at least some sort of form we maybe can't put a lable too) and because God created us all-God possibly has a mixture of both genders energies (I am not reffering to physical traits, but more of an energy-) As I don't think God has an actual gender. But alas I use the word "he" for conviniance.

[The Berean]

Who created the energy??

[Larimar]

nothing did. Isn't God just the first? I'm saying God IS both male and female-he is everything and all. The concept that everything must have formed from something-in my own opinion doesn't apply to God. God set everything in motion-perhaps even the big bang if that's what happened. Either way I don't believe anything created what God is, or what energy God has.I'm only using the word energy loosely-as I don't know what lable to give it-It may be a substance unlike anything anyone can comprehend for all I know.

[bluekrissyspikes]

i understand what you mean DS..i think of god in the same sort of way, and although i am not wiccan i just prefer to call her godesse.. it is the energy that is in everything and everyone that ties us all together, and keeps life going..we are all a part of it and it is a part of us...i call it mother earth usually, but for the purposes of this forum i refer to it/he/she as god so far...
and i dont' think that god is a person or else 'he' obviously wouldn't be called god.. and why on earth would i be violent to anyone? i would especially not want to harm a child...duh...nor do i see how that would prove anything...it is a proven fact that women are gentler and more loving than men..don't need to smack a child to prove it...science already has...it is just how it is.. in case you have never noticed the many natural differences between men and women, it is one....women are nurturing...

[Larimar]

Krissy, yes. To each his own about what to lable God. As everyone no matter what has the same one.

I'm not sure I agree with you in that females are more loving and nurturing. Men are usually more physically strond than a female -as females are built to be physically different then males-however you have all sorts of personality traits to play with here. Many mothers are known to kill their young or even abandon them-There is no instinct to nurture-this is the greatest myth of all. Women are equipt with being able to nurture their child during breast feeding-but it ends there.
There is not maternal instinct. Or at least I wouldnt call it instinct. The only thing a mother has over the father is that they are "sure" without a doubt it's their child. A father can't hav ethe same certainty.
However, none of that matters-as parents do not just love their own or no one would adopt.
Men love just as much as women-who can compare when everyone is so varied and different? I think its the way someone is raised and their personalities. There are many hard, strict women out there that were very mean and cold people-they were not gentle or loving-and there are so many men who are gentle and loving people. Who can judge based on gender? Not to offend you-but we can't be sexist by saying one gender is more so something and another is not-as there is no scientific data supporting that at all. Each culture i different-only our societies may treat women as suppose dto care for children and be gentle-however there are other cultures where mothers have to kill their own young for the people to survive.

If you mean women can get more emotional than a man can-I might agree there..as PMS and certain hormones can highten the senses -yet this can make a women very angry o very sad..not loving and gentle in those cases.

if you'd like to support your theory with some data-i'd be interested in reading it..however I'm going to safely say that men and women are both capable of loving equally as well.

peace /ubbthreads/images/%%GRAEMLIN_URL%%/smile.gif

[The Berean]

I thought science proved that nothing can come from nothing?

[The Berean]

"it is a proven fact that women are gentler and more loving than men"

Bull.

[KDawg]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: bluekrissyspikes</div><div class="ubbcode-body">it wasn't very nice of you guys to attack DS like that...we are entitled to our opinions as well, and it is not reasonable to expect her to have some ancient bible in front of her to translate differences to you....</div></div>

Attack? How? It is not unreasonable to except somebody to be able to back up what they say.

[Larimar]

Nothing can come from nothing-sure here maybe..Under therules God gave us...but I doubt God's existence follows the rules or laws of our sciences-I don't think God came from anything-he just always was and always is and always will be. -jmo