A Great Editorial

[Bluesky]

From the National Post

http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/holy-post/archive/tags/Editorial/default.aspx

[dancingqueen]

I guess to me, Christmas means something else. I am sure, however, this will be a very nice editorial to read for others :)
Merry Christmas, and Happy Holidays soonet :)

[Blunt]

C+ Editorial.

It lost grades because by the 4th paragraph, the article had induced boredom.

[Soundbear]

Well, no wonder that's when boredom set in:

"But the Christian claim has not lost its power to captivate, to perplex, to inspire."

:) :) :)

[Blunt]

Well, no wonder that's when boredom set in:

"But the Christian claim has not lost its power to captivate, to perplex, to inspire."

:) :) :)

Clearly it has lost its power to captivate, perplex and inspire.

Now it has the power to bore one to sleep. I may save a copy of this article in case I ever have a bout with insomnia. ;)

[Bluesky]

Some people get passionate about statistics and stamp collecting. Others consider it a snore.
It's all relative.
Merry Christmas, SB.
To you, Blunt, have a great day.

[Blunt]

Some people get passionate about statistics and stamp collecting. Others consider it a snore.
It's all relative.
Merry Christmas, SB.
To you, Blunt, have a great day.

And a Merry Commercialized Statutory Holiday With No Literal Importance Since It Wasn't Actually Jesus' Birthday to you.

Ho Ho Ho

[R W G R]

Blunt reminds me of the middle school kid who runs around telling everyone Dec 25 isn't really the day Jesus was born...like he's breaking some earth-shattering news ...LOL

Seriously, there is NO WAY he is over 16. Way too many of his actions mirror those of school kids.

[dancingqueen]

Blunt reminds me of the middle school kid who runs around telling everyone Dec 25 isn't really the day Jesus was born...like he's breaking some earth-shattering news ...LOL

Seriously, there is NO WAY he is over 16. Way too many of his actions mirror those of school kids.

So, what is the religious association of Christmas to Christianity? What is all the "Keep Christ in Christmas" about? What is Christ's place in Christmas?

[R W G R]

So, what is the religious association of Christmas to Christianity? What is all the "Keep Christ in Christmas" about? What is Christ's place in Christmas?

Tune into 99.5 YES FM today. I have a three-hour Christmas special, explaining the history of Christmas.

My gift to you and others. :)

[dancingqueen]

I don't have 3 hours right now :p
can you give me the condensed version?

[R W G R]

I don't have 3 hours right now :p
can you give me the condensed version?

Nope.

Guess you'll just have to tune in next year ;0

[dancingqueen]

On that note, I wonder why Jesus' true birthday is not celebrated.
I mean sure, everyday is a celebration of the birth of Christ for most Christians I would assume, and all Christians worth their own weight in anything... but what about the actual day he was born?
Jesus' birthday would be quite the cause of even more celebration right?
I don't even have a clue when it actually is supposed to be.

[Soundbear]

That's because the real reason He came, to pay for man's sin, is much more important. And THAT date is nailed down.

[dancingqueen]

That's not at all what I asked though.

[Soundbear]

That's not at all what I asked though.

I know. I just don't have much time to major on minors.

[dancingqueen]

so you answer a question nobody asked?....
If you're strapped for time, I find that to be counter-productive :/

[R W G R]

The Church picked a day that coincided with the secular celebration of the Solstice. It also was important to have a Feast Day around the darkest days of the year (remember, Christmas comes just four days after the day with the shortest sunlight in the calender year). Also, in many ways the Church's hand was played for them by the secular festivities of Christmas. Knowing they couldn't stop them, yet also wanting to bring all under one umbrella of celebration, the Church decided December 25th was a good way to meet the secularists half-way. If they couldn't totally stomp out secular festivities based around lewd behavior and drunkenness, they could at least enter the fray and try to bring a religious aspect to the holiday; one that would temper the raucousness and rowdiness of the Solstice celebrations.

Religion has always had an 'on again / off again' relationship with Christmas. While Christmas never went away for Catholics over the centuries, Protestants have banned and accepted Christmas at different times. Protestants never allowed Christmas for a long time, and in England Churches were ordered to close down on Christmas Day.

But people have always loved Christmas. It always had a life of its own. And soon enough Protestant and Church of England authorities caved in, and Christmas was back. It was also soon after that Clement Moore and Charles D1ckens added their efforts to the definition of Christmas, and the result is this Christmas we have today: a mix of the secular (Santa Claus) and Holy (Jesus' birth). And that secular/religious dynamic is the exact same one the Early Church had to deal with when the celebration of Christmas on December 25th was instituted around the Third Century.

So those that complain about Christmas losing the meaning of Christ are a bit disingenuous. The tension between the secular and the religious was with us from the very first Christmas. And remember, it was the Church that chose to join the secular on this date, a date the secular world had on its celebratory calender for years.

If anything happened on Dec 25th of importance for the Church, it may have been The Annunciation, when the angel Gabriel announced to Mary she was to give birth to the Son of God, as it seems it is probable that Jesus was born in late-September.

[dancingqueen]

Interesting, Thanks Alpha.... But I have to say, this makes it sound like this was instated as a means to control another group (the secular) and an effort to prevent them from their form of celebration.
Now that this other tradition has been squashed and destroyed, the church no longer needs to hide behind this story, I wonder why Jesus' actual birth date is not celebrated.

That was very informative though Alpha, thanks for explaining that.

edited to add:

I know negative actions are not unique to the Christian religion. I wonder if there where other reasons that these festivities needed to be toned down, or if the church had reason other than "that's not our religion" to intervene.

[R W G R]

Interesting, Thanks Alpha.... But I have to say, this makes it sound like this was instated as a means to control another group (the secular) and an effort to prevent them from their form of celebration.
Now that this other tradition has been squashed and destroyed, the church no longer needs to hide behind this story, I wonder why Jesus' actual birth date is not celebrated.

That was very informative though Alpha, thanks for explaining that.

But think about it, DQ: it's not unreasonable that the Church was concerned with a week-long celebration that involved all sorts of lewd behavior and drunkenness. The Church felt such behavior could do no good for people, and thus acted. You may not agree, but I don't think there is anything sinister about it. It certainly was not some conspiracy to get 'control' on a hapless populace.

The Church never thought Dec 25 was the real birth-date. The simple Gospel story of the shepherds abiding by their flocks told even the simplest of people back then it couldn't have been winter when this occurred. People today seemed more shocked that Dec 25 wasn't the real day of Jesus' birth than probably most people were one thousand years ago.

A day was picked to celebrate the birth of Christ. That day was Dec 25. And so the tradition continues.

Why is this so controversial?

[dancingqueen]

But think about it, DQ: it's not unreasonable that the Church was concerned with a week-long celebration that involved all sorts of lewd behavior and drunkenness. The Church felt such behavior could do no good for people, and thus acted. You may not agree, but I don't think there is anything sinister about it. It certainly was not some conspiracy to get 'control' on a hapless populace.

Why is this so controversial?

I am not trying to make it controversial, because to judge someone, or a group of people for what they did a long time ago by today's standards is pointless and unfair, I was just trying to discuss it. I actually find it hard to believe that it was only due to lewd behavior, that sounds like a silly reason, unless there where other reasons... then again, comes that whole judging others by today's standards :confused2: so maybe that was the only reason.
Like I said in my edit on the last post, by no means is Christianity the only religion that has done this stuff, I was only trying to converse about it. It is interesting, and new information. that's all. at first reading of the post I was appalled that the church would do such a thing, but I find I often have to remind myself that times where different back then, and what may be seen as important now, was not of the greatest concern back then.