Canada's Slide Into Secularism Continues

[RWGR]

The 3- and 4-year-olds at the Childcare Centre of Hebrew Foundation were always excited on Fridays. They’d get to re-create the rituals their parents typically perform for Friday night dinner, an integral part of the Jewish Sabbath, or Shabbat.

On a rotating basis, each child would be designated, if female, to light candles and say a blessing or, as a boy, bless the challah bread. The “wine” would be grape juice.

But on Friday, there was no Shabbat simulation. And there probably never will be again, if the Quebec government can help it.

“My 4-year-old daughter is devastated she can’t do her Shabbat next year,” said Sandy Jesion, who sends his child to the daycare in Dollard-des-Ormeaux, a Montreal suburb where he lives.

Nor are there any more prayers before the mid-morning snack. No stories about Noah’s Ark. No recounting of the parting of the seas.

As of last Wednesday, subsidized daycare and early-childhood learning centres in Quebec have had to abide by a new directive prohibiting religious activities, which the government expects to foster the integration of all children.

In effect, daycares have become the latest entities to confront the ongoing march toward a secular public sphere in Quebec, one that the rest of Canada isn’t following and has some wondering how far it will go.

http://www.thestar.com/news/canada/article/1002616--quebec-s-march-to-secularism-hits-daycare

[Blunt]

It's daycare, not Sunday school; kids aren't supposed to be indoctrinated at daycare.

It's good that they're not brainwashing kids; parents shouldn't have to worry about religions being forced upon their children while they're at work.

[Bluesky]

It's that difficult to understand?? It's the Childcare Centre of Hebrew Foundation.
I take it that the very REASON parents enroll their kids there is so that they WILL be taught the values of their faith.

I would not consider sending my kid to a Christian school if I did not agree with the tenets of Christianity.

[official soonet pu$$ycat]

"It uses “fellowship” to help chronic drinkers quit the bottle. But there is little fellowship in a schism that splintered the Alcoholics Anonymous umbrella group in the GTA this week. At issue is this question: Do alcoholics need God?"

http://www.thestar.com/news/article/1002750--does-religion-belong-at-aa-fight-over-god-splits-toronto-aa-groups?bn=1


I was reading the paper this morning and looks like our drunks are next. I don't have an opinion either way, I just thought maybe someone would be interested. The one thing I do notice is that a lot recovering addicts of drugs and alcohol say they turn to God. I always hear that.

[Bluesky]

For a long time in AA, they were encouraged to think of a God "whatever they perceive him/her to be". They have not necessarily been Christian in their approach in the last few years, although they certainly started out that way.

[dancingqueen]

AA also has one of the lowest success rates, I think I read somewhere, around 5%... Courts should not be mandating such a thing IMO.
Quit for yourself, not for your God.

On note of the OP, If my tax dollars are going to a gov't substitised day care, no, I do not think they should be teaching religion. However, if it is privately funded, That would be different.

[Soundbear]

If AA is the lowest, what's the best??

[NewCasa]

This is about Quebec, they're not really part of Canada anyway.

[Bluesky]

DQ, in Ontario, as you know, taxpayers choose whether they want their taxes to go to the separate or public school system.
Anyone know if it is the same in QC?

[NewCasa]

You know, in a way what they're doing is drawing a clearer separation between church and state, with the state saying to the church 'if you want money from these people, get it yourself'. So really, what they're doing is de-secularizing the church.

I've always thought that state-sponsored religion was a bad thing, both for the state and the religious. Once again, this is a great source for Sunday Christians, for example.

[Soundbear]

What's the name of that US outifit that fights for the separation of church and state??

They don't exist here.

[Blunt]

It's that difficult to understand?? It's the Childcare Centre of Hebrew Foundation.

I'm not talking about that case. I'm talking about the overall philosophy below:


As of last Wednesday, subsidized daycare and early-childhood learning centres in Quebec have had to abide by a new directive prohibiting religious activities, which the government expects to foster the integration of all children.

In effect, daycares have become the latest entities to confront the ongoing march toward a secular public sphere in Quebec, one that the rest of Canada isn’t following and has some wondering how far it will go.

[Anapeg]

If they where to eliminate the subsidy they would be able to go back to their religious teaching, no? They are then by definition "private" and free of government dictates.

[Bluesky]

I would think so. I an not familiar with the private school situation in QC

[NewCasa]

I'm going to take issue with the title of this thread. I think instead it should read "Canada's Removal of Superstition from Education Makes Great Strides" ;)

[Blunt]

But then the thread would cease to sound like the baseless sensationalism that Bluesky needs.

[Bluesky]

But then the thread would cease to sound like the baseless sensationalism that Bluesky needs.

It see seems you need me. Otherwise you'd only have Soundbear to hassle.
As it is, that headline was generated by The Toronto Star, .

[Blunt]

It see seems you need me. Otherwise you'd only have Soundbear to hassle.
I "nee need" you like I "nee need" a case of athlete's foot, but I can understand why you would want to flatter yourself; given you've spent your life buying into a religion that has completely annihilated any self worth you may have had.


As it is, that headline was generated by The Toronto Star, .
I didn't say you thought it up, I said it had the sensational sound that you love.... .

[Soundbear]

I'm going to take issue with the title of this thread. I think instead it should read "Canada's Removal of Superstition from Education Makes Great Strides" ;)

Great indeed. But not necessarily good.

Will they re-write history, too, and how much religion has affected this continent??

[Soundbear]

What's the name of that US outifit that fights for the separation of church and state??

They don't exist here.

Oh, yeah the ACLU.

[dancingqueen]

Great indeed. But not necessarily good.

Will they re-write history, too, and how much religion has affected this continent??

I hope we do.

[NewCasa]

Great indeed. But not necessarily good.

Will they re-write history, too, and how much religion has affected this continent??

What a silly thing to say.

[Soundbear]

What a silly thing to say.

Silly??? Look at DQ's reponse!!!! That would be beyond silly!!!

[Blunt]

Silly??? Look at DQ's reponse!!!! That would be beyond silly!!!

Great defense.

"Well yeah, what I said was silly, but I mean, what someone else said was sillier."

[NewCasa]

Great defense.

"Well yeah, what I said was silly, but I mean, what someone else said was sillier."

Heh - beat me to it :)

[dancingqueen]

What, precisely, was silly about what I said?

[Soundbear]

I said will we re-write history, and you said I hope we do.

THAT is funny, in a perverse and dishonest way. And everyone else thinks that's OK. Interesting.

[dancingqueen]

I uh... hope we do re-write history... and how much seemingly increasing secularism affects this continent for the better.
clearly you meant to say something else... perhaps more witty or something, I'll give you another opportunity to try....

[Bluesky]

define what you mean by "rewriting history"

[dancingqueen]

making changes... that's what I mean anyways, It is clear that when Soundbear says something though he may have completely meant something different...
Probably made up what the term means, as is his style.

[Soundbear]

making changes... that's what I mean anyways, It is clear that when Soundbear says something though he may have completely meant something different...
Probably made up what the term means, as is his style.

I said, "Will they re-write history, too, and how much religion has affected this continent??"

I'm sure you would hate to admit how much Christianity has affected our lives for the better.

Go to school?? Thank the Christians. They started public schools.

Go to welfare? Thank the Christians. They started helping the poor, and continue to this day.

All over the world, the morality of Christians has affected civilization for the better.

[Bluesky]

DQ, to my mind, re-writing history general means historical revisionism. Is that what you mean by
I uh... hope we do re-write history...

[dancingqueen]

I said, "Will they re-write history, too, and how much religion has affected this continent??"

I'm sure you would hate to admit how much Christianity has affected our lives for the better.

Go to school?? Thank the Christians. They started public schools.

Go to welfare? Thank the Christians. They started helping the poor, and continue to this day.

All over the world, the morality of Christians has affected civilization for the better.

I have no problems with Christianity... unfortunately, there are very few real Christians in my experience, just those that go to church on Sundays and call themselves Christians

[dancingqueen]

DQ, to my mind, re-writing history general means historical revisionism. Is that what you mean by

no..