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IMHO
01-30-2014, 08:52 AM
Has anything ever been written about the teenage years of Jesus?? I wonder...did he have friends...a girl friend etc. What lifestyle did he lead ??

The Berean
01-30-2014, 09:09 AM
There is no biblical record of His life from age 12 to age 30.

Aristotle
01-30-2014, 12:44 PM
Lot's of theories out there, but they are not evidence-based, just conjecture.

The Left Sock
01-30-2014, 01:00 PM
Rumor has it he went East, spent some time hanging out with the Buddhists.

Aristotle
01-30-2014, 01:22 PM
Rumor has it he went East, spent some time hanging out with the Buddhists.

Hopefully, they could have certainly learned from him

Bluesky
01-30-2014, 02:09 PM
mmm. I suspect Soc believes that's where Jesus found himself. or his teachings. :)

Aristotle
01-30-2014, 02:16 PM
CNN likes to dip its toes in the "Jesus: the lost years" pool, and usually the results are borderline comedic.

The Left Sock
01-30-2014, 02:53 PM
An interesting plot twist - just skip ahead to minute 39 of the video:

http://www.buddhastation.com/open-mind-videos/jesus-was-a-buddhist-monk-bbc-documentary/

Aristotle
01-30-2014, 03:03 PM
Buddhastation.com?

I'll pass, thanks :)

Bluesky
01-30-2014, 03:11 PM
What I said...

The Left Sock
01-30-2014, 03:18 PM
Hey, I didn't produce the video. Blame that on the BBC!

Bluesky
01-30-2014, 10:22 PM
I don't think there needs to be blame attached to anyone. Fiction is entertaining.

Hans
01-31-2014, 06:12 AM
There is no biblical record of His life from age 12 to age 30.


So what happened at age 10?

Bluesky
01-31-2014, 06:52 AM
umm, Hans, the sentence above your query...

Aristotle
01-31-2014, 08:33 AM
So what happened at age 10?

There weren't many records from birth to twelve, either. Berean wasn't inferring there were great records from birth to twelve, then nothing, then they picked up again at 30.

The best records are from 30-33. Next would be the records of his birth. At twelve, we know he entered a temple and amazed those in attendance with his curiosity and knowledge. It may have been the first time some people began to think the young 'prodigy' was special indeed. Special, and to some, dangerous.

Bluesky
01-31-2014, 09:47 AM
There weren't many records? Are you saying there are some at all?
There are none, unless the Vatican knows of some.

Aristotle
01-31-2014, 09:51 AM
There weren't many records? Are you saying there are some at all?
There are none, unless the Vatican knows of some.

are you saying the Gospels of Mark and Luke, for instance, do not give us records of Jesus' birth? (or did your council vote yesterday the Gospels now mean something different than they did last week?) ;)

That's what I was referring to, records of his birth.

Bluesky
01-31-2014, 10:06 AM
Ahh. I get it. But Hans was asking specifically about Jesus at age 10. He might have inferred from your response that there were indeed a few records of him at that age.
OK, as you were.. not working today?

Aristotle
01-31-2014, 10:58 AM
Ahh. I get it. But Hans was asking specifically about Jesus at age 10. He might have inferred from your response that there were indeed a few records of him at that age.
OK, as you were.. not working today?

Nope, today is the day we bring mom to the hospice house.

The Left Sock
01-31-2014, 12:45 PM
Agreed upon facts:

- When Jesus was born, 3 wise men from the East traveled to see him, and used a star as a guide. (Buddhists travel the world in search of new Buddhas, using stars and birth marks as indicators of the Buddha).

- When Jesus reached adolescence, the records of him disappear, and he was said to have traveled east. (Buddhist training in ancient times correlates with this).

- When Jesus was 30, he re-appeared, with an exciting new theology, that was separate and distinct from contemporary Jewish thought. According to the Gospel of Thomas, a number of things he said mirrored words of the Buddha. (complete Buddhist monk training would take about this long).

So, fiction? Maybe, maybe not.

Those who ignore these glaring facts might be employing a selective reality. No need for fiction there.

Aristotle
01-31-2014, 02:06 PM
The following are not "agreed upon facts":

"...he was said to have traveled east"

"...a number of things he said mirrored words of the Buddha"

The Berean
01-31-2014, 05:42 PM
...Those who ignore these glaring facts might be employing a selective reality. No need for fiction there.

We can easily see where the fiction lies.

I have to wonder how much of the bible one would have to dump to believe this tripe.

The Left Sock
02-01-2014, 04:31 AM
The most important man in Christian history was MIA for most of his short life.

Some people like to speculate on what he was up to, for those missing years.

If it was that important, and he was in the neighborhood the whole time, you would think the guys who wrote the Bible would have kept better records.

I think it's a fair assumption to suggest he was out of the country for an extended period, wouldn't you?

Bluesky
02-01-2014, 09:39 AM
He was not "MIA" :)

The Gospels were not written as biographies. The authors had other purposes in mind than the ones you assume.

The Berean
02-01-2014, 09:42 AM
The most important man in Christian history was MIA for most of his short life.

Some people like to speculate on what he was up to, for those missing years.

If it was that important, and he was in the neighborhood the whole time, you would think the guys who wrote the Bible would have kept better records.

I think it's a fair assumption to suggest he was out of the country for an extended period, wouldn't you?


Nope, I don't think that's a reasonable idea. He was a child in a small country, to all outward appearances, an ordinary person, except to his parents. Why would any of the writers, who were mostly His disciples later in His life, miss something that important? They DID record the time He impressed the elders of the Temple with His wisdom at age twelve. Other than that, it's much more reasonable to think He was learning His earthly father's trade, and doing what all Jewish boys did, learning from His people about God and the stories of the bible.

A journey of thousands of miles and years in length, with training in eastern wisdom was never recorded simply because it never happened.

Bluesky
02-01-2014, 09:57 AM
Anyone care for a dash of truth for breakfast this morning?

Nicolas Notovich, 1887[edit]
Main article: Nicolas Notovitch


Nicolas Notovitch
In 1887 a Russian war correspondent, Nicolas Notovitch claimed that while at the Hemis Monastery in Ladakh, he had learned of the document "Life of Saint Issa, Best of the Sons of Men" - Isa being the Arabic name of Jesus in Islam.[31][32] Notovitch's story, with a translated text of the "Life of Saint Issa," was published in French in 1894 as La vie inconnue de Jesus Christ (Unknown Life of Jesus Christ).[6][32]

Notovitch's writings were immediately controversial and Max Müller stated that either the monks at the monastery had deceived Notovitch (or played a joke on him), or he had fabricated the evidence.[33][34] Muller then wrote to the monastery at Hemis and the head lama replied that there had been no Western visitor at the monastery in the past fifteen years and there were no documents related to Notovitch's story.[35] J. Archibald Douglas then visited Hemis monastery and interviewed the head lama who stated that Notovitch had never been there.[35] Indologist Leopold von Schroeder called Notovitch's story a "big fat lie".[36] Wilhelm Schneemelcher states that Notovich's accounts were soon exposed as fabrications, and that to date no one has even had a glimpse at the m****cripts Notovitch claims to have had.[6]

Notovich at first responded to claims to defend himself.[37] But once his story had been re-examined by historians, Notovitch confessed to having fabricated the evidence.[36] Bart D. Ehrman states that "Today there is not a single recognized scholar on the planet who has any doubts about the matter. The entire story was invented by Notovitch, who earned a good deal of money and a substantial amount of notoriety for his hoax".[38]

Fraudulent claim. Why am I not surprised?
Oops. forgot my source - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unknown_years_of_Jesus

hobo
02-01-2014, 11:08 AM
Agreed upon facts:

- When Jesus was born, 3 wise men from the East traveled to see him, and used a star as a guide. (Buddhists travel the world in search of new Buddhas, using stars and birth marks as indicators of the Buddha).

LOL There may have been three wise men and there may have been 12 there is no evidence as to the numbers of the magi but there was only 1 buddha unless you are counting statues.

The Berean
02-01-2014, 11:15 AM
About the magi. There were three gifts recorded in the bible, but no mention of the number of magi.

Also, something fudged on. The magi saw the star, calculated where to go, and arrived two years after the birth. The star appeared again to guide them to the house where Jesus was.

The Left Sock
02-01-2014, 03:45 PM
"Notovitch learned, while he was there, that there existed ancient records of the life of Jesus Christ. In the course of his visit at the great convent, he located a Tibetan translation of the legend and carefully noted in his carnet de voyage over two hundred verses from the curious document known as "The Life of St. Issa."

He was shown two large yellowed volumes containing the biography of St. Issa. Notovitch enlisted a member of his party to translate the Tibetan volumes while he carefully noted each verse in the back pages of his journal.

When he returned to the western world there was much controversy as to the authenticity of the document. He was accused of creating a hoax and was ridiculed as an imposter. In his defense he encouraged a scientific expedition to prove the original tibetan documents existed.

One of his skeptics was Swami Abhedananda. Abhedananda journeyed into the arctic region of the Himalayas, determined to find a copy of the Himis m****cript or to expose the fraud. His book of travels, entitled Kashmir O Tibetti, tells of a visit to the Himis gonpa and includes a Bengali translation of two hundred twenty-four verses essentially the same as the Notovitch text. Abhedananda was thereby convinced of the authenticity of the Issa legend."

http://www.christianforums.com/t2037525/

The actual legend of St. Issa:

http://lifeofsaintissa.blogspot.ca/

So, why all the hostility? Jesus can't be the Son of God, if he went East and taught belief in one almighty God to a bunch of Buddhists?

A little too sensitive, and too quick to dismiss. You would think those who hold Jesus in such high regard would be actively interested in what he was up to, that the Bible didn't chronicle.

The Berean
02-01-2014, 06:46 PM
"Notovitch confessed to having fabricated the evidence."

One of those things to make you say, "Hmmmm."

One thing for sure, we don't NEED to chase stories like this, because they have no eternal value.

Anything that takes our eyes off God is bad, regardless of its veracity.

Aristotle
02-02-2014, 11:35 AM
"Notovitch learned, while he was there, that there existed ancient records of the life of Jesus Christ. In the course of his visit at the great convent, he located a Tibetan translation of the legend and carefully noted in his carnet de voyage over two hundred verses from the curious document known as "The Life of St. Issa."

He was shown two large yellowed volumes containing the biography of St. Issa. Notovitch enlisted a member of his party to translate the Tibetan volumes while he carefully noted each verse in the back pages of his journal.

When he returned to the western world there was much controversy as to the authenticity of the document. He was accused of creating a hoax and was ridiculed as an imposter. In his defense he encouraged a scientific expedition to prove the original tibetan documents existed.

One of his skeptics was Swami Abhedananda. Abhedananda journeyed into the arctic region of the Himalayas, determined to find a copy of the Himis m****cript or to expose the fraud. His book of travels, entitled Kashmir O Tibetti, tells of a visit to the Himis gonpa and includes a Bengali translation of two hundred twenty-four verses essentially the same as the Notovitch text. Abhedananda was thereby convinced of the authenticity of the Issa legend."

http://www.christianforums.com/t2037525/

The actual legend of St. Issa:

http://lifeofsaintissa.blogspot.ca/

So, why all the hostility? Jesus can't be the Son of God, if he went East and taught belief in one almighty God to a bunch of Buddhists?

A little too sensitive, and too quick to dismiss. You would think those who hold Jesus in such high regard would be actively interested in what he was up to, that the Bible didn't chronicle.

Jesus may or may not have gone to the East. But what we do know for sure is that the theory is not "agreed upon fact".

There is no hostility, but there is disagreement with, yet again, passing off some theory as indisputable truth.

Bluesky
02-03-2014, 12:11 PM
Unless we could detect in significant measure that Jesus influenced the course of Buddhism in India with his teaching, or that his own teaching that we do have a record of was influenced by eastern thought, the theory is highly unreasonable.

On top of that, we do know enough from ANE studies that it would be highly unlikely that a peasant boy from a backward province in Palestine would undertake such a venture, specially in light of the probable fact that as a first born son, he would have to support his mother, due to Joseph's alleged absence.

Aristotle
02-03-2014, 12:55 PM
If Jesus supposedly traveled east and learned about Buddhism it seems his silence on the subject would possibly mean he did not find it all that attractive. Why? Because he makes no mention of other religions or belief systems. He tells us there is but one way to God: through him.

So the "Jesus went east and learned" theory is suffering from two things: one, there is no evidence he did so (kind of problematic, that); and two, if he actually went, it left no indelible mark on him.

The Left Sock
02-03-2014, 06:58 PM
"On top of that, we do know enough from ANE studies that it would be highly unlikely that a peasant boy from a backward province in Palestine would undertake such a venture, specially in light of the probable fact that as a first born son, he would have to support his mother, due to Joseph's alleged absence."

Well, it was reported that his family fled to Egypt, right? That suggests the means and ability to travel. And then you take a look at what the Disciples did as soon as Jesus was gone (travel, even as far east as India), and you have to ask yourself; was this what Jesus was doing before he showed up on the religious scene at age 30?

If Jesus acted like a normal Jew until age 30, he would have been married with a boatload of rug-rats by the time the New Testament catches up with him. That is not the narrative, so extensive travel abroad explains several aspects of his situation.

Since no one really knows what happened from childhood until 30, the only thing left to do is look at the facts, and make reasonable guesses. Travel, instead of marriage and children, is a reasonable assertion.

Bluesky
02-04-2014, 08:33 AM
There's a difference between possible and plausible and then there is probable.

Aristotle
02-04-2014, 08:49 AM
Since no one really knows what happened from childhood until 30, the only thing left to do is look at the facts, and make reasonable guesses. Travel, instead of marriage and children, is a reasonable assertion.

Sure, if you mean travel around Palestine. But all the way to the far east? Highly unlikely.

The Voice
02-05-2014, 07:04 PM
Well, it was reported that his family fled to Egypt, right? That suggests the means and ability to travel.

Golan to Gaza 129 Miles

Israel to India 2500 Miles.

I can see the perfect correlation there.