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KDawg
02-16-2015, 07:24 PM
The Islamic State terror group released a video on Sunday showing the Islamic jihadis beheading 21 Egyptian Christians who were previously kidnapped in Libya.

The Islamic State’s Al Hayat Media, the group that has published the previous beheading videos in the Middle East, produced the Libya video titled, “A Message Signed With Blood To The Nation Of The Cross.”

“All praise is due to Allah the strong and mighty,” said an ISIS jihadist dressed in military fatigues in American-accented English. “And may blessings and peace be upon the ones sent by the sword as a mercy to all the worlds,” he added.

After the ISIS leader finishes speaking, his fellow terrorists then commence the beheading of the 21 Egyptian Christians. “And we will conquer Rome, by Allah’s permission, the promise of our Prophet, peace be upon him,” The militant leader says after his comrades slaughter the Christian hostages.http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/02/15/isis-beheads-21-christians-promises-to-conquer-rome-by-allahs-permission/

These people are evil incarnate.

As terrible as this is, at least some media is seeing past all the PC garbage and reporting on the persecution of Christians.

What do you do?

RWGR
02-17-2015, 08:21 AM
Blunt, who has a serious bone to pick with Christianity, seems quite ho-hum about the atrocities committed by fanatical Islam

Selective anger, that always points to: "agenda"

Anapeg
02-17-2015, 02:19 PM
Were my people, Christian or otherwise being killed by any means in a foreign land, common sense would tell me, avoid that country. Large numbers of my people being put to death might initiate a mass exodus from said foreign land. They show up on our shores attempting similar behaviour would bring retribution from our laws but alas, we are there, not here. Our laws hold no sway. People in a given country behave in a manner I dislike, I avoid that country.
Large cats reside in zoos. Large cats eat people. I do not go into the cages housing large cats. Where there is a known problem it is only prudent to avoid wherever "there" might be. We have most everything here in North America there is in the Middle Est other than Muslims and Islam. Some people of the Muslim and Islamic faith dislike Christians. Why then go into their "cages" and antagonize? They have oil, we have oil. They have sand, we have sand, add to this we have scantily clad women and alcohol, why go there??

RWGR
02-17-2015, 02:29 PM
Were my people, Christian or otherwise being killed by any means in a foreign land, common sense would tell me, avoid that country. Large numbers of my people being put to death might initiate a mass exodus from said foreign land. They show up on our shores attempting similar behaviour would bring retribution from our laws but alas, we are there, not here. Our laws hold no sway. People in a given country behave in a manner I dislike, I avoid that country.
Large cats reside in zoos. Large cats eat people. I do not go into the cages housing large cats. Where there is a known problem it is only prudent to avoid wherever "there" might be. We have most everything here in North America there is in the Middle Est other than Muslims and Islam. Some people of the Muslim and Islamic faith dislike Christians. Why then go into their "cages" and antagonize? They have oil, we have oil. They have sand, we have sand, add to this we have scantily clad women and alcohol, why go there??

Many of their governments and businesses bring us over there to help modernize their infrastructure.

Also, many of the Christians they are slaughtering now are Arab Christians.

Bluesky
02-17-2015, 03:09 PM
Were my people, Christian or otherwise being killed by any means in a foreign land, common sense would tell me, avoid that country. Large numbers of my people being put to death might initiate a mass exodus from said foreign land. They show up on our shores attempting similar behaviour would bring retribution from our laws but alas, we are there, not here. Our laws hold no sway. People in a given country behave in a manner I dislike, I avoid that country.
Large cats reside in zoos. Large cats eat people. I do not go into the cages housing large cats. Where there is a known problem it is only prudent to avoid wherever "there" might be. We have most everything here in North America there is in the Middle Est other than Muslims and Islam. Some people of the Muslim and Islamic faith dislike Christians. Why then go into their "cages" and antagonize? They have oil, we have oil. They have sand, we have sand, add to this we have scantily clad women and alcohol, why go there??


Anapeg.. these are Coptic Christians. They have lived in that land for centuries. ISIS wasn't in that land. ISIS moved in.

Another thing. SOme westerners who have been killed by ISIS are there as humanitarian workers. To simply tell them to stay out of the lions cage while the lion is systematically destroying others who are native to that cage is also problematic.

So while here in the west our ahteists write books that continue to tell people the lie that religion destroys everything, Christians go to lands that are plagues by Ebola and other crises to try to help. For instance that young lady whose life was destroyed in Syria.. She was there to help the poor and the destitute refugees.

So it isn't as simple as to say Stay out.. because to stand by and not do anything to help the innocents is not an option.

Anapeg
02-17-2015, 05:41 PM
War, turmoil, strife, decapitations are hardly new to the area. This has been from time immemorial. It seems as well we have been there almost as long trying to sort things out. We are not winning. We are not even making a dent. We do serve to make things worse by our presents. Perhaps were we removed from the equation things may settle a tad? This is a war of religion. More religion tossed into the mix is akin to throwing gas cans onto an already free burning fire. When everyone is clothed the same other than us, how does one separate the combatants.

RWGR
02-17-2015, 06:32 PM
It's not a war of religion, it's one religion's radical sect killing others who will not bow down to their demands.

Blue mentioned Coptic Christians. They trace their roots back to the first century. They were in these lands long, long before Islam, and exceedingly well before ISIS.

Coptic Christians roamed the landscape by 100 AD. The first Muslim would not do so until around 640 AD, or so.

So whom is encroaching on whom?

Anapeg
02-17-2015, 06:45 PM
We ought set boundary's based on what was in 100 AD? Who was there prior to that? When and where did the Jews show up? How far back do we go here in North America when settling Native demands. Not all things are based on who was first. If this were so our world would be a very different place, Native complaints aside. Man has been around for how long? Could be interesting, could it not? Back up to the last victor and move on from there shall we?

KDawg
02-17-2015, 07:19 PM
We ought set boundary's based on what was in 100 AD? Who was there prior to that? When and where did the Jews show up? How far back do we go here in North America when settling Native demands. Not all things are based on who was first. If this were so our world would be a very different place, Native complaints aside. Man has been around for how long? Could be interesting, could it not? Back up to the last victor and move on from there shall we?
Will you blame a homeowner for a home invasion because they left their front door unlocked?

The Left Sock
02-17-2015, 07:25 PM
ISIS are truly monstrous animals. Their depraved indifference to human life, and intolerance towards others is not something we have seen in a few generations.

Having said that, the vast majority of people executed and/or beheaded by ISIS have been other Muslims. The stories of foreign journalists and aid workers, and now Coptic Christians, resonates far more deeply in the West, but the truth is, there is no case here for religious persecution. ISIS simply tries to destroy anyone who is 'not them'.

I don't see what point can be made here by Christians who are claiming that the execution of Coptics amounts to religious persecution, when many of these same Christians would likely argue that the Coptics aren't even 'real' Christians, in some other thread on this forum.

Stick to the point. ISIS is bad. It needs to be literally and completely destroyed. This movement must die. Everything else, is just a distraction.

The Voice
02-17-2015, 07:38 PM
http://www.msn.com/en-ca/news/world/is-burns-to-death-45-in-west-iraq/ar-BBhFswk


You can spin it any way you want but this is anything but the religion of peace.


These people are sick and we should bomb them back to the stone age.


Famine will be the next step for Isis controlled area's.

The Voice
02-17-2015, 07:40 PM
We ought set boundary's based on what was in 100 AD? Who was there prior to that? When and where did the Jews show up? How far back do we go here in North America when settling Native demands. Not all things are based on who was first. If this were so our world would be a very different place, Native complaints aside. Man has been around for how long? Could be interesting, could it not? Back up to the last victor and move on from there shall we?


Then the Jews are in charge of Palestine.

The Left Sock
02-17-2015, 07:46 PM
Islam, Judaism, Christianity, none of these are religions of 'peace'. They all have blood on their hands, all are guilty, and all continue down the same paths they always have.

If we are going to bomb one of them into the Stone Age, might as well do a clean sweep, and do the job right.

Anapeg
02-17-2015, 08:36 PM
All religions preach peace yet we can have no peace for those self same religions fighting.

The Left Sock
02-17-2015, 08:54 PM
The ironic thing is, they all have the same God, at the root of their beliefs.

Anapeg
02-18-2015, 05:40 AM
Will you blame a homeowner for a home invasion because they left their front door unlocked?

I am sorry KDawg, the relevance of your post to my particular post eludes me. Were you perhaps intending to highlight another post? The question is otherwise difficult to answer out of context or, lack of same.

Bluesky
02-18-2015, 09:06 AM
All religions preach peace yet we can have no peace for those self same religions fighting.

I simply wanted to point out that your analogy of encroaching upon the lion's cage is not a good analogy for what happened in Libya.
And Soc, I agree with you in that whether those being murdered are Christians or not, it makes no difference. All are equal in dignity and value. A human life is a human life, and this needs to be stopped.

On the other hand, Christians of various stripes are being persecuted in those countries like never before. Of that you can be certain.

RWGR
02-18-2015, 09:15 AM
We ought set boundary's based on what was in 100 AD?

Sorry, I guess that mindset is only allowed when we are talking about the Jews encroachments in the Middle East

RWGR
02-18-2015, 09:17 AM
I don't see what point can be made here by Christians who are claiming that the execution of Coptics amounts to religious persecution, when many of these same Christians would likely argue that the Coptics aren't even 'real' Christians, in some other thread on this forum.

.

Strawman.

Your entire premise fails.

RWGR
02-18-2015, 09:19 AM
I'll indulge you, even though you're something of a running joke.



I've struck a nerve.

I apologize.

Anapeg
02-18-2015, 09:33 AM
Sorry, I guess that mindset is only allowed when we are talking about the Jews encroachments in the Middle East

That is worthy of it's own discussion. This is set on the premise of who you know.

Bluesky
02-18-2015, 09:43 AM
Soc says there is a thread that argues that Coptic Christians are not real Christians. Where is that thread?

RWGR
02-18-2015, 10:48 AM
Soc says there is a thread that argues that Coptic Christians are not real Christians. Where is that thread?

Was wondering the same thing

RWGR
02-18-2015, 05:00 PM
I don't see what point can be made here by Christians who are claiming that the execution of Coptics amounts to religious persecution
.

The Islamic State’s Al Hayat Media, the group that has published the previous beheading videos in the Middle East, produced the Libya video titled, “A Message Signed With Blood To The Nation Of The Cross.”

http://www.breitbart.com/national-security/2015/02/15/isis-beheads-21-christians-promises-to-conquer-rome-by-allahs-permission/

The Left Sock
02-18-2015, 07:03 PM
Soc says there is a thread that argues that Coptic Christians are not real Christians. Where is that thread?

I said, "I don't see what point can be made here by Christians who are claiming that the execution of Coptics amounts to religious persecution, when many of these same Christians would likely argue that the Coptics aren't even 'real' Christians, in some other thread on this forum."

Note the phrase, "would likely argue".

But to put it to rest immediately, Coptics believe in salvation though works, which makes them not true Christians, according to evangelicals.

http://pulpitandpen.org/2015/02/16/coptic-christians-not-christians-southern-baptist-leaders-need-reminded/

So there you have it.

So once again, Christians claiming they are being persecuted under one flag is hard to stomach, when you spend half your time eating each other.

Barry Morris
02-18-2015, 08:15 PM
I said, "I don't see what point can be made here by Christians who are claiming that the execution of Coptics amounts to religious persecution, when many of these same Christians would likely argue that the Coptics aren't even 'real' Christians, in some other thread on this forum."

Note the phrase, "would likely argue".

But to put it to rest immediately, Coptics believe in salvation though works, which makes them not true Christians, according to evangelicals.

http://pulpitandpen.org/2015/02/16/coptic-christians-not-christians-southern-baptist-leaders-need-reminded/

So there you have it.

So once again, Christians claiming they are being persecuted under one flag is hard to stomach, when you spend half your time eating each other.

You amaze me again, Sock. You just don't get it.

Some info about it:

"Theologically, Coptic Christianity is very similar to Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy. They profess to be genuine followers of Jesus Christ and a part of His worldwide Church. But, as with Catholicism, they tend to emphasize meritorious works in salvation along with liturgical ritual rather than salvation through a personal relationship with Jesus Christ."

http://www.gotquestions.org/Coptic-Christianity.html

Hans
02-18-2015, 10:24 PM
It is a complicated matter.
You cannot just bomb ISIS because that means you must bomb the soil of a country that is partially occupied and risk starting a bigger confrontation.
You cannot just invade the area ISIS operates in because it stretches across 3 sovereign nations.
You cannot just stop them because the sovereign nations who control the area not capable of providing much if any counter measures, or are involved in an internal civil war/power vacuum.
You cannot just launch some kind of military action in that area because it immediately causes a world wide oil panic and will put huge stress on many Western economies.

ISIS played this one well.

The only options are:

- Find out who arms and funds ISIS and force them to stop. Likely not going to happen as that is a delicate matter.
- Arm whoever wants to fight ISIS and hope they destroy ISIS. Likely not going to work as nobody in that area seems to be eager to fight ISIS.
- Invade the area and watch the card falls. Might work, might make it worse. Regardless of how brutal ISIS operates, we are not allowed to be violate the Geneva conventions so there is no guarantee they will actually stop.

Now, as for the reason why ISIS popped up to begin with:
That is our own fault.

We removed Saddam from power, who's regime kept these kind of groups in check.
We removed Gadaffi from power, who's regime kept these kind of groups in check.
We are standing on the sidelines of Assad, because he is to close to the Russians and does not always follow human rights when he "takes care of business".

ISIS exploited that situation by operating in all 3 of those regions, trying to gain control and hiding when required.
They know it is politically difficult to do any kind of liberation in that area, and they have not really officially occupied anything.

Might be best to turn the other cheek for now, and hope the organization loses steam and dies a slow death.

RWGR
02-19-2015, 08:19 AM
But to put it to rest immediately, Coptics believe in salvation though works, which makes them not true Christians, according to evangelicals.

http://pulpitandpen.org/2015/02/16/coptic-christians-not-christians-southern-baptist-leaders-need-reminded/.

You're simply showing your ignorance on the subject.

Many Evanegelicals also say Roman Catholics believe we are saved through works. This is not true, the Catechism clearly states as much, but that hasn't stopped many Evengelicals from claiming it is true.

You think using a few Evangelicals as a source as to what Coptics believe is legit? Perhaps I should use what some Hindus believe about Buddhism as a legit source on Buddhist beliefs?

By running out to Google to try and support your argument with the first few sites that pop up you actually make yourself look even less-informed than before.

The Left Sock
02-19-2015, 10:08 AM
Anyone else want to line up to admit that I'm right, but then claim that I'm wrong?

Barry Morris
02-19-2015, 10:51 AM
Anyone else want to line up to admit that I'm right, but then claim that I'm wrong?

No, you're doing quite well on your own.

You're not an evangelical, and you're not a Roman Catholic. Don't claim to know all about either.

RWGR
02-19-2015, 11:15 AM
Anyone else want to line up to admit that I'm right, but then claim that I'm wrong?

not even sure what that means

The Left Sock
02-19-2015, 06:46 PM
Well, both of you keep pointing out that Protestants, Evangelicals and Baptists think that Coptics, Catholics, and Greek Orthodox aren't real Christians because they think they can be saved by works, but then you keep telling me I don't know what I'm talking about.

If there wasn't this division in ideology, there would be no need for Protestants, Evangelicals and Baptists to exist, now would there? But they do exist, so therefore, I am right.

RWGR
02-20-2015, 09:28 AM
Well, both of you keep pointing out that Protestants, Evangelicals and Baptists think that Coptics, Catholics, and Greek Orthodox aren't real Christians because they think they can be saved by works, but then you keep telling me I don't know what I'm talking about.

If there wasn't this division in ideology, there would be no need for Protestants, Evangelicals and Baptists to exist, now would there? But they do exist, so therefore, I am right.


okay...WHAT???

Barry Morris
02-20-2015, 09:52 AM
okay...WHAT???

Don't ask, he doesn't know.

You'd think he never noticed ETHNIC churches, either.

RWGR
02-20-2015, 09:57 AM
agreed

Bluesky
02-20-2015, 10:03 AM
Soc, you get upset when we tell you you don't know what you are talking about. But this latest post of yours, well.. you need to do some review.
1. RWGR has NEVER denied that Protestants were Christians.
2. I have never denied that Roman Catholicism was Christian.

Are there some Protestants who are not Christians? Of course. And the same goes for RCs.

Are there Christians who believe in the necessity of works for their salvation? Yes. Are they lost because of that belief? No.

The fact that diverse denominations exist has nothing to do with this thread.

The Left Sock
02-20-2015, 10:27 AM
Come, come now. You hear the hushed whispers in quiet corners, where members of your faith titter over the Catholics, and how they have it all wrong.

Let's put aside niceties, and get to some reality.

Some people in your line of faith think the Pope is the Anti-Christ. At the very least, you think the Pope is a mortal man trying to play God.

You think, in this day and age, you can still hide your prejudices?

RWGR
02-20-2015, 10:50 AM
A classic case of goalpost moving 101

Bluesky
02-20-2015, 12:12 PM
Come, come now. You hear the hushed whispers in quiet corners, where members of your faith titter over the Catholics, and how they have it all wrong.

Let's put aside niceties, and get to some reality.

Some people in your line of faith think the Pope is the Anti-Christ. At the very least, you think the Pope is a mortal man trying to play God.

You think, in this day and age, you can still hide your prejudices?

Yup. First it was YOU TWO. Now it is "some people in our line of faith"

I agree. Some people in my line of faith believe that chemtrails are viral seeding of North Americans to make them sick so Pharmaceuticals corporations can make lotsa money.

BFLPE
02-22-2015, 01:06 AM
ISIS is bad. It needs to be literally and completely destroyed. This movement must die. Everything else, is just a distraction.We have a winner.

All we get from the political leaders is distraction though.

The Left Sock
02-22-2015, 06:05 AM
Looks like post #41 and #42 got accidentally reversed.

The Voice
03-24-2015, 08:26 PM
Looks Like The Sock took his Bat and Ball and went home.

Anapeg
03-24-2015, 09:01 PM
I read were Harper wants to bomb ISIS for another year or some such thing. How exactly does one identify and discern an ISIS group from any other where the people dress damn near identical, from 20 or 30 thousand feet. To make any inroads you would be required to engage them on the ground. Gorilla war fare being what it is we will still have our arses kicked but we may get a few more of them in return.

Bluesky
03-24-2015, 10:51 PM
I think they are using Iraqi troops and others on the ground to tag the targets..

Anapeg
03-24-2015, 11:41 PM
I think they are using Iraqi troops and others on the ground to tag the targets..

They will have to start passing out programmes, I have difficulty remembering who is friend and who is foe in the middle East.

The Voice
04-10-2015, 08:47 AM
How exactly does one identify and discern an ISIS group

ISIS is the Group that is beheading their enemies and enslaving their civilian captives.

RWGR
04-10-2015, 11:32 AM
ISIS is the Group that is beheading their enemies and enslaving their civilian captives.

That is intolerant and judgmental.

For your punishment you will be required to write to numerous local newspapers and describe the horrors inflicted on society by Christian culture and values.

Sincerely,

The Left

Reckidecky
04-14-2015, 05:57 PM
The ironic thing is, they all have the same God, at the root of their beliefs.

Ignorance at its finest!

The Voice
04-18-2015, 05:33 PM
Ignorance at its finest!


As If??


The One True God, The God of Abraham is common to all three religions. Ergo they are referred to as "Abrahamic Religions".


Just curious, would you like me to provide a link to the definition of ignorance??

Barry Morris
04-18-2015, 07:14 PM
As If??


The One True God, The God of Abraham is common to all three religions. Ergo they are referred to as "Abrahamic Religions".


Just curious, would you like me to provide a link to the definition of ignorance??

Please do.

While you are doing that, consider that the Muslims actually worship a pagan god, the Moon God.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-encyclopedia-westerners-need-to-know-list.htm

There is much more information about this on the net.

dancingqueen
04-18-2015, 07:36 PM
Please do.

While you are doing that, consider that the Muslims actually worship a pagan god, the Moon God.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-encyclopedia-westerners-need-to-know-list.htm

There is much more information about this on the net.

Oh thank HEAVENS!!!!! Finally, an impartial source to tell us the truth.... Wait, I think I found evidence of how the whole Bible is actually a recipe book for cooking children,
www.thebiblesucksandisevilbutyoucantrustmebecausei amanimpartialsource.com

Barry Morris
04-18-2015, 07:38 PM
Oh thank HEAVENS!!!!! Finally, an impartial source to tell us the truth.... Wait, I think I found evidence of how the whole Bible is actually a recipe book for cooking children,
www.thebiblesucksandisevilbutyoucantrustmebecausei amanimpartialsource.com

I could easily twist stuff too.

If I had as little real knowledge.

dancingqueen
04-18-2015, 07:40 PM
I could easily twist stuff too.

If I had as little real knowledge.

Well, that went right over your head....
I'm not even a little surprised....

Barry Morris
04-18-2015, 07:41 PM
Well, that went right over your head....
I'm not even a little surprised....

You may think so if you wish.

It was actually very obvious.

Sorry.

dancingqueen
04-18-2015, 07:43 PM
You may think so if you wish.

It was actually very obvious.

Sorry.

I know it was obvious, I'm still not surprised you missed the point.
doesn't really take much.

Barry Morris
04-18-2015, 07:53 PM
I know it was obvious, I'm still not surprised you missed the point.
doesn't really take much.

I suggest that you need to take a few more "obscurity" lessons.

The Voice
04-19-2015, 01:24 AM
Please do.

While you are doing that, consider that the Muslims actually worship a pagan god, the Moon God.

http://www.bible.ca/islam/islam-encyclopedia-westerners-need-to-know-list.htm

There is much more information about this on the net.

This is a Stinking pile of Bu!!***** and you know it.

Islam is an Abrahamic Religion and all the rest is a smoke screen.

Wacko Christian Rhetoric from a Wacko Christian Webpage.

Barry Morris
04-19-2015, 08:38 AM
This is a Stinking pile of Bu!!***** and you know it.

Islam is an Abrahamic Religion and all the rest is a smoke screen.

Wacko Christian Rhetoric from a Wacko Christian Webpage.

This is not new information. Look around, especially at Arab history.

I won't debate it with you. If Christian cults can exist, then it is obvious the Arab people might get off the right track too.

RWGR
04-19-2015, 11:39 AM
Murdering people because they won't join your religion is "off track"

The Voice
04-19-2015, 12:54 PM
This is not new information. Look around, especially at Arab history.

I won't debate it with you. If Christian cults can exist, then it is obvious the Arab people might get of the right track too.

You might dispute the validity of Islam that is your prerogative.

But none the less there is nothing to debate about Islam being a Abrahamic Religion.

They worship the God of Abraham the same as the Christians.

This is a Historical "FACT" Look it up.

You will also contend that other Christians beliefs are Invalid. So the proof as they say is in the pudding.

The Voice
04-19-2015, 12:56 PM
Murdering people because they won't join your religion is "off track"

Good thing the Christians eventually figured that out.

Barry Morris
04-19-2015, 02:11 PM
...

They worship the God of Abraham the same as the Christians.
....

Yes they did. Then along came Mohammed.

Barry Morris
04-19-2015, 02:13 PM
Good thing the Christians eventually figured that out.

Christians preached that from the beginning, unlike Islam.

Some were only so-called Christians, and wanted power.

RWGR
04-19-2015, 03:47 PM
Good thing the Christians eventually figured that out.

When did Christians murder people if they didn't become Christian?

Barry Morris
04-19-2015, 06:12 PM
There's actually quite a few documented historical accounts of that...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_and_Paganism#Prohibition_and_persecut ion_of_Paganism_in_the_Roman_Empire

Even without the obvious political ramifications, how can one who acts in a manner totally opposite to the title he claims actually be a Christian???

RWGR
04-19-2015, 06:40 PM
There's actually quite a few documented historical accounts of that...



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christianity_and_Paganism#Prohibition_and_persecut ion_of_Paganism_in_the_Roman_Empire

A *******ization of Christianity.

The Koran actually calls for death to the infidels

Barry Morris
04-19-2015, 09:16 PM
A *******ization of Christianity.

The Koran actually calls for death to the infidels

The worst Jesus commanded was to shake the dust off your feet at them, a cultural thing, and move on.

Guess Who?
04-20-2015, 09:56 AM
I am always humoured when people quote Wikipedia as their source of "fact". Simply open a Wiki account and create your own "fact". I know it isn't accepted by scholars, but I guess Soonet is above them.

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 10:47 AM
I am always humoured when people quote Wikipedia as their source of "fact". Simply open a Wiki account and create your own "fact". I know it isn't accepted by scholars, but I guess Soonet is above them.

And just how long would that so-called fact last on Wiki???

I have yet to see anyone counter a Wiki statement with proof that it is false.

RWGR
04-20-2015, 10:54 AM
And just how long would that so-called fact last on Wiki???

I have yet to see anyone counter a Wiki statement with proof that it is false.

Well, the particular article that claimed the Israeli PM ate Palestinian babies sort of relied on common sense to "prove it is false"

Barry, most college profs will not accept papers that use Wiki as a source. That says something, doncha' think?

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 10:58 AM
Well, the particular article that claimed the Israeli PM ate Palestinian babies sort of relied on common sense to "prove it is false"

Barry, most college profs will not accept papers that use Wiki as a source. That says something, doncha' think?

It says the profs want the students to go to the original sources. It says nothing about the veracity of Wiki.

RWGR
04-20-2015, 11:01 AM
It says the profs want the students to go to the original sources. It says nothing about the veracity of Wiki.

It does not say that in all cases. Original sources are big in history classes, but they are not the only sources used.

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 12:16 PM
Re Wiki: Be as smart as a cow. Eat the hay, spit out the straw.

I can do that.

Guess Who?
04-20-2015, 02:16 PM
And just how long would that so-called fact last on Wiki???

I have yet to see anyone counter a Wiki statement with proof that it is false.


Well, the particular article that claimed the Israeli PM ate Palestinian babies sort of relied on common sense to "prove it is false"

Barry, most college profs will not accept papers that use Wiki as a source. That says something, doncha' think?


It says the profs want the students to go to the original sources. It says nothing about the veracity of Wiki.

Having just finished the current year at university, I can tell you that you know nothing about the "veracity" of Wiki. My brother tried the same line with me, so I simply went to Wiki, created an account, and edited a source he quoted to make a fool of him. Would you like me to do that for you, .... just quote me the Wiki source, I will be happy to make you look like a fool.

RWGR
04-20-2015, 04:15 PM
Re Wiki: Be as smart as a cow. Eat the hay, spit out the straw.

I can do that.

So if you know what is hay and what is straw then why would you go to Wiki in the first place? Obviously you know all there is to know about an issue or event.

RWGR
04-20-2015, 04:16 PM
And Muslims denounce radicals as a *******ization of Islam.

They sure are quiet about it.



True. So does the Old Testament.

Where does the OT tell Jews to kill non-Jews?

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 04:56 PM
Having just finished the current year at university, I can tell you that you know nothing about the "veracity" of Wiki. My brother tried the same line with me, so I simply went to Wiki, created an account, and edited a source he quoted to make a fool of him. Would you like me to do that for you, .... just quote me the Wiki source, I will be happy to make you look like a fool.

If you did, or could, you would be the first person here to ever bother to actually respond with proof of an error in Wiki.

As someone said, like any "encyclopedia", it is self correcting.

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 04:59 PM
.... and edited a source he quoted to make a fool of him. ....

You want to explain this exactly?? You changed a Wiki quote just to make your brother look stupid.

Which account had the error, the original, (in which case thanks for the correction) or the one you put in, (in which case, is it still there?)

Guess Who?
04-20-2015, 06:21 PM
If you did, or could, you would be the first person here to ever bother to actually respond with proof of an error in Wiki.

As someone said, like any "encyclopedia", it is self correcting.

Who is "someone",.... source, link.

Guess Who?
04-20-2015, 06:25 PM
You want to explain this exactly?? You changed a Wiki quote just to make your brother look stupid.

Which account had the error, the original, (in which case thanks for the correction) or the one you put in, (in which case, is it still there?)
Why are you trying to deflect the obvious fact you have been caught in a lie? You are looking foolish without me even having to do anything, ... you make my life easy, thank you. Everyone that knows anything about Wikipedia knows you can't trust anything there as fact.

Barry Morris
04-20-2015, 09:20 PM
Swore an oath to God to kill anyone who would not seek God... Which pleased God. Close enough?

Close except for one problem.

It would also include Jews.

By the way, the New Testament commands us not to swear oaths.

The Voice
04-20-2015, 09:33 PM
When did Christians murder people if they didn't become Christian?

Okay I will give you this one on semantics.

But don't ask me to believe that The Crusades, The Pogroms, The Inquisition, The Salem Witch Trials, Etc. Etc. Etc. Didn't happen.

The Voice
04-20-2015, 09:35 PM
Yes they did. Then along came Mohammed.

What in heck are you talking about?

Islam didn't exist until Mohamed.

He was the founder.

?

The Voice
04-20-2015, 09:36 PM
I'm guessing you probably don't really know anything about Islam.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 04:43 AM
What in heck are you talking about?

Islam didn't exist until Mohamed.

He was the founder.

?

I see it's no use quoting you, then responding.

RWGR
04-21-2015, 08:15 AM
Swore an oath to God to kill anyone who would not seek God... Which pleased God. Close enough?
Nope.

That is within the context of the Jewish people. It is not condemning death on any Gentile who did not seek God.

My original question asked where the OT commands non-Jewish people to be put to death for not worshiping God. And, your original comment was about "Christians". Then you moved the goalposts to the OT.

Why?

Also, where does it say "God was pleased"?

RWGR
04-21-2015, 08:20 AM
Okay I will give you this one on semantics.

But don't ask me to believe that The Crusades, The Pogroms, The Inquisition, The Salem Witch Trials, Etc. Etc. Etc. Didn't happen.

The Crusades were initiated in response to regaining once-Christian territories form Muslim invasion.

What "Pogroms"?

The Inquisition was a very small event carried out by people who took Christian tenets into their own. Again, no biblical source to do such a thing.

The Salem Witch Trials...see above. No biblical source to do such a thing.

So, we're back at step one: the Koran calls for the slaying of the infidel, the Bible does not.

The Voice
04-21-2015, 11:40 AM
I see it's no use quoting you, then responding.

Just think it wasn't too long ago I would have earned a disruptive behavior or insulting other member demerit, for merely pointing out your obvious ignorance of the subject matter.

The Voice
04-21-2015, 11:40 AM
The Crusades were initiated in response to regaining once-Christian territories form Muslim invasion.

What "Pogroms"?

The Inquisition was a very small event carried out by people who took Christian tenets into their own. Again, no biblical source to do such a thing.

The Salem Witch Trials...see above. No biblical source to do such a thing.

So, we're back at step one: the Koran calls for the slaying of the infidel, the Bible does not.

I digress.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 12:03 PM
Why are you trying to deflect the obvious fact you have been caught in a lie? You are looking foolish without me even having to do anything, ... you make my life easy, thank you. Everyone that knows anything about Wikipedia knows you can't trust anything there as fact.

Not a problem, just post the truth.

The day will never arrive that I worry about being thought foolish by you.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 12:05 PM
Just think it wasn't too long ago I would have earned a disruptive behavior or insulting other member demerit, for merely pointing out your obvious ignorance of the subject matter.

I really am not in the least concerned if you believe that.

Hans
04-21-2015, 09:57 PM
And Muslims denounce radicals as a *******ization of Islam.

They sure are quiet about it.



True. So does the Old Testament.

Where does the OT tell Jews to kill non-Jews?

Deuteronomy 17
If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Hans
04-21-2015, 09:58 PM
Or Deuteronomy 13:

6 If your very own brother, or your son or daughter, or the wife you love, or your closest friend secretly entices you, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods that neither you nor your ancestors have known, 7 gods of the peoples around you, whether near or far, from one end of the land to the other), 8 do not yield to them or listen to them. Show them no pity. Do not spare them or shield them. 9 You must certainly put them to death. Your hand must be the first in putting them to death, and then the hands of all the people. 10 Stone them to death, because they tried to turn you away from the Lord your God, who brought you out of Egypt, out of the land of slavery. 11 Then all Israel will hear and be afraid, and no one among you will do such an evil thing again.

12 If you hear it said about one of the towns the Lord your God is giving you to live in 13 that troublemakers have arisen among you and have led the people of their town astray, saying, “Let us go and worship other gods” (gods you have not known), 14 then you must inquire, probe and investigate it thoroughly. And if it is true and it has been proved that this detestable thing has been done among you, 15 you must certainly put to the sword all who live in that town. You must destroy it completely, both its people and its livestock. 16 You are to gather all the plunder of the town into the middle of the public square and completely burn the town and all its plunder as a whole burnt offering to the Lord your God. That town is to remain a ruin forever, never to be rebuilt.

Hans
04-21-2015, 10:01 PM
The Lord said to Moses, 2 “Take vengeance on the Midianites for the Israelites. After that, you will be gathered to your people.”

Moses was angry with the officers of the army—the commanders of thousands and commanders of hundreds—who returned from the battle.

15 “Have you allowed all the women to live?” he asked them. 16 “They were the ones who followed Balaam’s advice and enticed the Israelites to be unfaithful to the Lord in the Peor incident, so that a plague struck the Lord’s people. 17 Now kill all the boys. And kill every woman who has slept with a man, 18 but save for yourselves every girl who has never slept with a man.

Hans
04-21-2015, 10:02 PM
Not violent at all. Simple describing some good old fashioned mass murder.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 10:18 PM
Not violent at all. Simple describing some good old fashioned mass murder.

You are qualified to judge better then God?

Maybe He knows something you don't.

Anyone who harms His people in any way will pay a terrible price. It has always been that way, and I believe it always will. God is not a man. God has all the attributes of a mother. And I invite you to mess with any mother's child. She'll rip your guts out if she can.

Please note that God accepts non-Jews to become part of His people on occasion in the bible. Some of them even became the ancestors of Jesus.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 10:19 PM
Deuteronomy 17
If there be found among you, within any of thy gates which the LORD thy God giveth thee, man or woman, that hath wrought wickedness in the sight of the LORD thy God, in transgressing his covenant; 17:3 And hath gone and served other gods, and worshipped them, either the sun, or moon, or any of the host of heaven, which I have not commanded; 17:4 And it be told thee, and thou hast heard of it, and enquired diligently, and, behold, it be true, and the thing certain, that such abomination is wrought in Israel; 17:5 Then shalt thou bring forth that man or that woman, which have committed that wicked thing, unto thy gates, even that man or that woman, and shalt stone them with stones, till they die.

Those noted in bold were Jews.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 10:29 PM
And that, right there, is what turns people off religion.

Sure. Especially those who ignore what I said after that.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 10:36 PM
Dueteronomy 20...

in the cities of the nations the Lord your God is giving you as an inheritance, do not leave alive anything that breathes. 17Completely destroy them—the Hittites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites and Jebusites—as the Lord your God has commanded you. 18Otherwise, they will teach you to follow all the detestable things they do in worshiping their gods, and you will sin against the Lord your God.

I can honestly say that I don't understand what is going on in the world today, or what will happen in the future.

But I'd like you to note something. Maybe God had it right when He removed those people from the scene, to prevent them from affecting His people. He said "do not leave alive", and that's what happened.

Now as I said, I don't know what is going to happen, or how the situation can be resolved, but when the west kills a terrorist, his whole family knows it. And it has long been the Arab way to avenge their dead.

The solution to that is not pretty.

Barry Morris
04-21-2015, 11:25 PM
Maybe God had it right when He ordered the death of infidels in the Koran.

The basis of the bible is the Golden Rule.

The basis of the Koran is not quite the same!!!

And those non-jews who followed God's ways had no problems.

Did you know Job was not a Jew?

Hans
04-22-2015, 07:17 PM
You are qualified to judge better then God?

Maybe He knows something you don't.

Anyone who harms His people in any way will pay a terrible price. It has always been that way, and I believe it always will. God is not a man. God has all the attributes of a mother. And I invite you to mess with any mother's child. She'll rip your guts out if she can.

Please note that God accepts non-Jews to become part of His people on occasion in the bible. Some of them even became the ancestors of Jesus.

Does what you said not sound a bit like Nazi war propaganda to you?
It sure has a lot of attributes that are similar.

Barry Morris
04-23-2015, 04:22 PM
Does what you said not sound a bit like Nazi war propaganda to you?
It sure has a lot of attributes that are similar.

Except the Golden Rule.

RWGR
04-23-2015, 04:40 PM
Except the Golden Rule.

God and Christianity would be Nazi-like if not for the Golden Rule???

Hans
04-23-2015, 05:58 PM
Except the Golden Rule.

I am not familiar with the term Golden Rule?

RWGR
04-23-2015, 06:07 PM
Do unto others as you would have them do to you