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View Full Version : Sault ranks best in N. Ont. for safe driving



KDawg
11-29-2015, 05:20 PM
The Sault is the safest city in Northern Ontario for driving, according to a newly-released national survey.http://www.sootoday.com/content/news/details.asp?c=101713

I find this very hard to believe.

IMHO
11-29-2015, 06:13 PM
IF this is true...one would not want to drive in ANY other northern communities.

Barry Morris
11-29-2015, 08:31 PM
"Tony Bossio, Northern Ontario media representative for Allstate, says the Saultís rise in rankings came despite a 9-percent rise in collision claims frequency over results from previous years."

There doesn't need to be a big difference to be the best.

BFLPE
11-29-2015, 09:39 PM
Not a surprise. The drivers here aren't that bad.

They don't understand that a turn lane (suicide lane) is not a merge lane or what lane to turn into (left turn into left lane, right turn into right lane) but enough are cautious enough that we don't have all that many collisions.

Barry Morris
11-29-2015, 10:27 PM
There's an intersection that I get a laugh at sometimes. Top of John, going eastbound on Second Line, there is a merge lane BUT the city put a yield sign there, probably because they do a lousy job keeping the snow out of it. When the lane is clear, the yield sign is meaningless.

Sometimes I'll pull up behind somebody who stops to wait for traffic. If there's enough room, I zip up the inside and merge with traffic, laughing all the way.

Several places like that in town.

Anapeg
11-30-2015, 07:29 AM
It drives me to distraction when someone stops in the merge lane. The idea of merging is foreign to many be it there or at the other end of Second Line.

kalam
11-30-2015, 02:27 PM
Hi Anapeg,


It drives me to distraction when someone stops in the merge lane. The idea of merging is foreign to many be it there or at the other end of Second Line.


This is an interesting situation in that there seems to be confusion with some in SSM over what is a merge lane, as opposed to a yield. For example, if by the "end of Second Line" you are referring to where Second Line meets Black Dirt Road, then this actually appears to be a "yield", and not a merge lane, and therefore stopping may very well be the right and legal decision depending on the circumstances:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5390316,-84.2875775,3a,75y,140.94h,78.77t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sOwb8o2_UWmSlk5reNLeQ-g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Same with the right hand turn onto black dirt road at the bottom of McNabb:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.522024,-84.2871109,3a,75y,299.05h,77.97t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLZp3fTux9V_6XoSTQOWpfA!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656


KaL

kalam
11-30-2015, 02:33 PM
Just to add:

"A yield sign is a triangle with a white background and a red border. It means you must let traffic in the intersection or close to it go first. Stop if necessary and go only when the way is clear."

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section3.1.0.shtml

KaL

Bluesky
11-30-2015, 03:00 PM
It drives me to distraction when someone stops in the merge lane. The idea of merging is foreign to many be it there or at the other end of Second Line.
Do that on an on-ramp on the 401 and it could get you killed.

Barry Morris
11-30-2015, 03:29 PM
Do that on an on-ramp on the 401 and it could get you killed.

I did that the hard way once. A wheel fell off, axle end and all!! Not good.

Barry Morris
11-30-2015, 03:32 PM
Just to add:

"A yield sign is a triangle with a white background and a red border. It means you must let traffic in the intersection or close to it go first. Stop if necessary and go only when the way is clear."

http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section3.1.0.shtml

KaL

I believe yield means yield to on-coming traffic. but if the lane you pull in to just started (in other words there IS no oncoming traffic), and is long enough, you merge.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 04:33 PM
This is an interesting situation in that there seems to be confusion with some in SSM over what is a merge lane, as opposed to a yield. For example, if by the "end of Second Line" you are referring to where Second Line meets Black Dirt Road, then this actually appears to be a "yield", and not a merge lane, and therefore stopping may very well be the right and legal decision depending on the circumstances:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5390316,-84.2875775,3a,75y,140.94h,78.77t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sOwb8o2_UWmSlk5reNLeQ-g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Same with the right hand turn onto black dirt road at the bottom of McNabb:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.522024,-84.2871109,3a,75y,299.05h,77.97t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLZp3fTux9V_6XoSTQOWpfA!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656


KaLStopping for a yield sign makes no sense when the lane is empty. Just because there are vehicles in the next lane over is no reason to come to a stop.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 04:34 PM
Do that on an on-ramp on the 401 and it could get you killed.True, but you're comparing apples to oranges.

Hans
11-30-2015, 06:23 PM
Hi Anapeg,




This is an interesting situation in that there seems to be confusion with some in SSM over what is a merge lane, as opposed to a yield. For example, if by the "end of Second Line" you are referring to where Second Line meets Black Dirt Road, then this actually appears to be a "yield", and not a merge lane, and therefore stopping may very well be the right and legal decision depending on the circumstances:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5390316,-84.2875775,3a,75y,140.94h,78.77t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sOwb8o2_UWmSlk5reNLeQ-g!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

Same with the right hand turn onto black dirt road at the bottom of McNabb:

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.522024,-84.2871109,3a,75y,299.05h,77.97t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sLZp3fTux9V_6XoSTQOWpfA!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656


KaL

A yield sign is a triangle with a white background and a red border. It means you must let traffic in the intersection or close to it go first. Stop if necessary and go only when the way is clear.
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section3.1.0.shtml

So in both those cases you only have to yield to traffic that is in the lane you are moving towards (merging with), not traffic from the opposing lane.

Anapeg
11-30-2015, 07:35 PM
Merge, get up to speed and entre traffic smoothly. Seems like a simple enough concept.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 08:45 PM
Merge, get up to speed and entre traffic smoothly. Seems like a simple enough concept.Not all that complicated. I might change the order a bit though. It's much easier to merge smoothly if you're already up to speed.

Hans
11-30-2015, 08:51 PM
The problem is that on some of these you have to speed up pretty fast in order to enter traffic smoothly.

I tend to hit 100 by the time I enter the S curve at location #1.
I always have a problem with the road sag in that area, it does a good job of testing your suspension when hitting 90.
But hey, I do anything to enter traffic smoothly.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 08:52 PM
lol, good 'ol Mario.

Hans
11-30-2015, 08:53 PM
That corner really gives good g-forces when you push it down. One of the best corners for that in this City.

Hans
11-30-2015, 09:01 PM
This is another awesome corner for G-forces. I almost lost it there ones.

https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5114848,-84.3193998,3a,30y,184.47h,83.6t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1szqMOPtbvdi007ZuZMWkDhg!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656!6m1!1e1?hl=en

Now turn the view 180 degrees and watch that beauty on the bike.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 09:06 PM
Now turn the view 180 degrees and watch that beauty on the bike.Is that Blackface?

Hans
11-30-2015, 09:10 PM
No, wrong clothing. That and they do not own bikes.

BFLPE
11-30-2015, 09:20 PM
Figured that would be too much of a coincidence.

Anyway, not my cup of tea but beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

kalam
12-01-2015, 10:16 PM
Hello, stupefied,


Stopping for a yield sign makes no sense when the lane is empty. Just because there are vehicles in the next lane over is no reason to come to a stop.

I am trying to picture how this would work - if the lane one wants to "merge" into for the moment is unmergable (granted, I just made that word up), and a "yield" sign is present, what is the driver to do, other than come to a stop?

KaL

kalam
12-01-2015, 10:19 PM
Hey there, Hans,


A yield sign is a triangle with a white background and a red border. It means you must let traffic in the intersection or close to it go first. Stop if necessary and go only when the way is clear.
http://www.mto.gov.on.ca/english/dandv/driver/handbook/section3.1.0.shtml

So in both those cases you only have to yield to traffic that is in the lane you are moving towards (merging with), not traffic from the opposing lane.

Yes, that is the same quote and link I believe I included in a post above as well. I believe you and I are saying the same thing, then, correct? Due to the "yield" sign, one may have to stop if unable to merge. In fact, the law requires it.

KaL

kalam
12-01-2015, 10:24 PM
Hi Anapeg,


Merge, get up to speed and entre traffic smoothly. Seems like a simple enough concept.

I don't recall off the top of my head, nor haven't gone back to the google maps street view, however I don't think a "merge" sign is present at either of these areas on the road. This leads me to believe these are not "merge" lanes in the manner in which you believe them to be. It sounds like, and of course I might be wrong, you believe these lanes to work similar to an on-ramp on the 401, for example.

KaL

Hans
12-01-2015, 10:45 PM
Hey there, Hans,



Yes, that is the same quote and link I believe I included in a post above as well. I believe you and I are saying the same thing, then, correct? Due to the "yield" sign, one may have to stop if unable to merge. In fact, the law requires it.

KaL

That is correct. The main issue with merge lanes in this city is that they require you to pull up to speed in a short stretch, to avoid running out of merge lane.

BFLPE
12-02-2015, 06:43 PM
Hi Anapeg,



I don't recall off the top of my head, nor haven't gone back to the google maps street view, however I don't think a "merge" sign is present at either of these areas on the road. This leads me to believe these are not "merge" lanes in the manner in which you believe them to be. It sounds like, and of course I might be wrong, you believe these lanes to work similar to an on-ramp on the 401, for example.

KaLLet's take the one at 2nd line and Black Rd.

You're coming off of 2nd onto Black. You're in the right lane of 2nd line and that lane does a 90 degree turn at Black. That lane is now the right lane of two SB lanes. After a fairly short distance it ends. Though a merge sign would make sense to me it's not rocket science to figure out you need to merge.

The yield sign is nowhere near where that lane ends though and to come to a stop where the yield sign is only makes is sense if you're stopping for a pedestrian crossing or the lane you're in is blocked.

BFLPE
12-02-2015, 06:49 PM
...they require you to pull up to speed in a short stretch, to avoid running out of merge lane.For some reason I don't think you have a problem with that.

Hans
12-02-2015, 07:46 PM
Oh, I don't. I love the g-forces I pull when taking the apex of a corner.
That and the faces of people when I pass them using the merge lane.

Only thing is I cannot do that in the snow, and have to turn the traction control off when it rains.

Barry Morris
12-02-2015, 11:37 PM
That is correct. The main issue with merge lanes in this city is that they require you to pull up to speed in a short stretch, to avoid running out of merge lane.

The Toyota truck I'm driving has as much horsepower as a wet chicken, and it has no trouble getting to the limit in any of the areas where this applies.

Anapeg
12-03-2015, 07:08 AM
Hi Anapeg,



I don't recall off the top of my head, nor haven't gone back to the google maps street view, however I don't think a "merge" sign is present at either of these areas on the road. This leads me to believe these are not "merge" lanes in the manner in which you believe them to be. It sounds like, and of course I might be wrong, you believe these lanes to work similar to an on-ramp on the 401, for example.

KaL

Acceleration lanes, same thing. In this situation, one gets to use their side mirrors if they know how.

Barry Morris
12-03-2015, 08:04 AM
Hello, stupefied,



I am trying to picture how this would work - if the lane one wants to "merge" into for the moment is unmergable (granted, I just made that word up), and a "yield" sign is present, what is the driver to do, other than come to a stop?

KaL

The lanes involved are all long enough to get up to speed. So you come up to the speed of traffic, and merge with it.

The yield signs are there to cover the city's butt when they don't keep the snow cleared out of the lanes.

The only time you might come to a complete stop is if the traffic was so bumper to bumper you just couldn't get in. That has never happened to me.

Barry Morris
12-03-2015, 08:05 AM
Acceleration lanes, same thing. In this situation, one gets to use their side mirrors if they know how.

Yeah, there's the problem!!!

Hans
12-03-2015, 06:32 PM
The Toyota truck I'm driving has as much horsepower as a wet chicken, and it has no trouble getting to the limit in any of the areas where this applies.

Go ahead and get up to 60 and join in safely during dense traffic, before the road abruptly ends: https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5158293,-84.2879502,3a,51.2y,225.63h,88.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYRuBKw5MWBRRenFHp38vOQ!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656?hl=en
Not to mention the facts most people drive 70 or more on that road.

I once had to pull up past 100 to merge in.

Barry Morris
12-03-2015, 10:11 PM
Go ahead and get up to 60 and join in safely during dense traffic, before the road abruptly ends: https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5158293,-84.2879502,3a,51.2y,225.63h,88.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYRuBKw5MWBRRenFHp38vOQ!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656?hl=en
Not to mention the facts most people drive 70 or more on that road.

I once had to pull up past 100 to merge in.

No problem, I'll give it a shot. What times do you go by there??

Haven't ever had a problem getting into traffic at that point, though some times of day might be busier.

Hans
12-04-2015, 06:15 AM
Try between 4 and 5. You should have a blast.

Anapeg
12-04-2015, 10:37 AM
Hans, I have been retired for years and got on my wife's nerves to the point she insisted I find something to occupy some of my time so I would cease following her as she did her housework. I started driving for a courier. I hit those acceleration lanes with some regularity and have rarely if ever experienced difficulty at any of these spots. Yes, I have on occasion had to accelerate hard but that happens in major centres with longer lanes as well. Acceleration and being aware of your surroundings are key. Should a person not require the ability or the intestinal fortitude for such a manoeuvre, they should not be behind the wheel.

BFLPE
12-04-2015, 06:29 PM
Go ahead and get up to 60 and join in safely during dense traffic, before the road abruptly ends: https://www.google.ca/maps/@46.5158293,-84.2879502,3a,51.2y,225.63h,88.8t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sYRuBKw5MWBRRenFHp38vOQ!2e0!7i1 3312!8i6656?hl=en
Not to mention the facts most people drive 70 or more on that road.

I once had to pull up past 100 to merge in.You hit 100+ there did ya. Considering the corner and the ability to see what's coming I'm thinking a different approach may have worked also. Super Mario, lol.

Hans
12-04-2015, 09:39 PM
Like I said, I love G-forces.
You know what is really fun in that corner also?
Turning left to go to the Dodge dealership. You have to pull up even harder because you have to cross 2 lanes of traffic, followed by a quick move into the turning lane and hard braking so you can turn left.

Hans
12-04-2015, 09:40 PM
Hans, I have been retired for years and got on my wife's nerves to the point she insisted I find something to occupy some of my time so I would cease following her as she did her housework. I started driving for a courier. I hit those acceleration lanes with some regularity and have rarely if ever experienced difficulty at any of these spots. Yes, I have on occasion had to accelerate hard but that happens in major centres with longer lanes as well. Acceleration and being aware of your surroundings are key. Should a person not require the ability or the intestinal fortitude for such a manoeuvre, they should not be behind the wheel.

You are not one of the guys who delivers food at my door, are you?

Anapeg
12-04-2015, 10:12 PM
You are not one of the guys who delivers food at my door, are you?

You would never know now, would you?

Hans
12-04-2015, 10:25 PM
That's why I asked.

Anapeg
12-05-2015, 08:01 AM
That is what I do when not handling car and truck parts. I work 8:30 to 5:30 or 6:00.

Hans
12-05-2015, 04:39 PM
Ah, so you might have delivered food for me. Interesting.

Anapeg
12-05-2015, 08:32 PM
Old fellow with mutton chops and a handlebar moustache.