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The Chronic Liar
04-18-2016, 10:10 AM
It's my own personal study I conducted while driving around and analyzing things such as clothes, driving habits, helmet choices, whether there were more than one person on it and how well they can drive while intoxicated. Out of a 3 person sample I have concluded that 100% of them are complete morons.

Anapeg
04-18-2016, 11:56 AM
It's my own personal study I conducted while driving around and analyzing things such as clothes, driving habits, helmet choices, whether there was more than one person on it and how well they can drive while intoxicated. Out of a 3 person sample, I have concluded that 100% of them are complete morons.

Seems fair and equitable to me.

Barry Morris
04-18-2016, 12:35 PM
Ya know, it seems to me that the same kind of thing has been said about anybody who drives something cheap, especially by those who have good jobs and can afford better cars.

Remember that survey here a few years back?? It cost about $750 average to drive a car every month!!!

If you can afford that, count your blessings.

And remeber that your life can change in an instant!!

The Chronic Liar
04-18-2016, 01:09 PM
Ya know, it seems to me that the same kind of thing has been said about anybody who drives something cheap

Nope. Just e-bikes.

Hans
04-18-2016, 07:08 PM
That is what happens when you buy a $60,000 truck on a 84 month "zero interest" plan.
Or you can get a 2 year old version at half the price.

Barry Morris
04-18-2016, 09:21 PM
That is what happens when you buy a $60,000 truck on a 84 month "zero interest" plan.
Or you can get a 2 year old version at half the price.

No Hans, it is not.

19 people responded to my survey. The AVERAGE cost was $750. The top was around 1200, and the low about $425.

Interestingly enough, CAA agreed, two years or so later.

Barry Morris
04-18-2016, 09:23 PM
Nope. Just e-bikes.

You don't remember Lada, do you?? :) :) :)

When seatbelts became law, the medical community saw a drop in donor organ availability. E-bikes might help that!!!

Anapeg
04-18-2016, 10:15 PM
Anything allowed on our streets and highways ought to require a drivers licence, licence plates and insurance. Any conveyance is capable of causing or being involved in an accident and as such must be identifiable and insured. As well the operators should be liable to lose the right to use the roads. Anything less is unfair and unjust.

Barry Morris
04-18-2016, 10:35 PM
Anything allowed on our streets and highways ought to require a drivers licence, licence plates and insurance. Any conveyance is capable of causing or being involved in an accident and as such must be identifiable and insured. As well the operators should be liable to lose the right to use the roads. Anything less is unfair and unjust.

Bicycles??

Anapeg
04-18-2016, 10:44 PM
Bicycles??

Most certainly. Can they not cause or be involve in a mishap?

Barry Morris
04-18-2016, 11:02 PM
Most certainly. Can they not cause or be involve in a mishap?

Indeed.

But a 12 year old can ride a bicycle.

Who pays??

Hans
04-18-2016, 11:15 PM
No Hans, it is not.

19 people responded to my survey. The AVERAGE cost was $750. The top was around 1200, and the low about $425.

Interestingly enough, CAA agreed, two years or so later.

Average cost of what exactly? Purchase price, or other?

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 01:19 AM
Indeed.

But a 12-year-old can ride a bicycle.

Who pays??

Parents.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 08:58 AM
Anapeg...just stop. You're embarrassing yourself.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 09:05 AM
Anapeg...just stop. You're embarrassing yourself.

Yup, sure.

In fact, we're both laughing - at you!!!

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 09:12 AM
Average cost of what exactly? Purchase price, or other?

In the survey I asked people to figure out the costs of EVERYTHING, and break it down to a monthly cost. Then the reality of car ownership would show up.

If you get a tuneup every couple of years, dived the cost by 24 months. Wipers once a year, divide by 12. Insurance is easy, as is gas, but include tires (cost about $5 a month), oil changes, brake jobs, windshield washer fluid, car washes, there are all kinds of little things we ignore.

One CAA site said a compact car cost about $9500 a year. That's $791 a month.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 09:13 AM
Yup, sure.

In fact, we're both laughing - at you!!!

Says the laughingstock of this site.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 09:13 AM
Parents.

Bicycles would be banned.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 09:13 AM
In the survey I asked people to figure out the costs of EVERYTHING, and break it down to a monthly cost. Then the reality of car ownership would show up.

If you get a tuneup every couple of years, dived the cost by 24 months. Wipers once a year, divide by 12. Insurance is easy, as is gas, but include tires (cost about $5 a month), oil changes, brake jobs, windshield washer fluid, car washes, there are all kinds of little things we ignore.

One CAA site said a compact car cost about $9500 a year. That's $791 a month.

LOL he is referring to his 19 person survey. Hilarious.Your same method has been deciding whether they serve hotdogs or pizza at school field trips for decades.

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 10:20 AM
My cost of operating a car in TOronto is roughly $235 per month, using Barry's metrics.
Add my parking garage cost and it is $360 per month. Believe it or not, parking is my biggest expense.
I walk almost everywhere or use one of those accursed bicycles that you all are hating on.. ;)

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 10:48 AM
LOL he is referring to his 19 person survey. Hilarious.Your same method has been deciding whether they serve hotdogs or pizza at school field trips for decades.

LOL, the usual nonsense from the anonymous sniper. You just called a bunch of people morons on the basis of three of them. Seems you analytical skills disappeared after that two for one deal with the cat at the vet.

And I found it quite interesting that CAA agreed with my figures.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 10:50 AM
My cost of operating a car in TOronto is roughly $235 per month, using Barry's metrics.
Add my parking garage cost and it is $360 per month. Believe it or not, parking is my biggest expense.
I walk almost everywhere or use one of those accursed bicycles that you all are hating on.. ;)

Parking garage. Never thought of that one. Of course, ANY type of parking adds to the cost, but it's not included in my estimates.

How many miles do you drive per month??

RWGR
04-19-2016, 10:56 AM
LOL, the usual nonsense from the anonymous sniper.

http://i296.photobucket.com/albums/mm161/Lacaz/machine-gun-cat-animation.gif

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 11:10 AM
Seems to me I was poking fun at silly studies with stupid sample sizes with stupid stipulations. Little did I know you would come at us with your own silly 19 person study and actually be serious about it. That just made it all the better. Thanks for the laugh. Again.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 11:15 AM
And I found it quite interesting that CAA agreed with my figures.

Yet you still keep referring back to your study as though it is the superior one. How funny is that? And you aren't a hero for calculating the cost of driving a car. You didn't even add parking by your own admission hahaha. Excellent work Barry. That tells me you screwed up in a different area if your numbers came back similar.

Anyone can add up the costs. I spent 45 bucks at Metro on groceries the other day. I added up everything I purchased. It was interesting that my receipt agreed with my figures.

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 11:34 AM
Parking garage. Never thought of that one. Of course, ANY type of parking adds to the cost, but it's not included in my estimates.

How many miles do you drive per month??

I do roughly 10K km per yr

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 11:37 AM
I do roughly 10K km per yr

Which oddly enough, if you spread out all of Barry's incoherent posts across the country, it would be about the same.

RWGR
04-19-2016, 11:39 AM
https://media.giphy.com/media/4aBQ9oNjgEQ2k/giphy.gif

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 11:46 AM
Anyone can add up the costs. .


Anyone except you it appears!!!

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 11:49 AM
I do roughly 10K km per yr

So, when you said 235 a month (we'll ignore parking, as it's not usually a direct cost here), did you add up EVERYTHING??

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 11:51 AM
Anyone except you it appears!!!

I don't think we should trust how things appear to you. You've proven time and time again that you can't put into words anything that you see. I bet if you were explaining a suspect to a cop, the sketch would end up looking like a sailboat.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 11:53 AM
(we'll ignore parking, ....

....Because real data is not important in my experiments.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 12:02 PM
Ok so now that we are ignoring the thousands of people who either work or go to the college, the university, hospital, Group Health, doctors building or who park downtown.... go on with your story.

RWGR
04-19-2016, 12:03 PM
Wouldn't disregarding the cost of parking in a large city be about the same as disregarding how much junk food a person eats when attempting a study on what makes people obese?

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 12:14 PM
Wouldn't disregarding the cost of parking in a large city be about the same as disregarding how much junk food a person eats when attempting a study on what makes people obese?

You have to admire the fact that he is trying this whole economics thing though. His next lecture will be how Buy One Get One Free is so much better than Get 50% off when you buy 2.

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 12:19 PM
yup. I had this car for only year, so I have not had to replace anything on it. No tires, which I expect will last me about 4 more years, no need for replacing wipers every year. 2 oil changes per year. I repair of front brakes. That's it.

RWGR
04-19-2016, 12:24 PM
I get two oil changes per year, too. The idea you need to change oil every few thousand miles was a conveneint myth made up by garages and oil filter companies.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 01:05 PM
....Because real data is not important in my experiments.

Oh, and you pay to park your car when you aren't using it?? In this town??

Use your head.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 01:13 PM
yup. I had this car for only year, so I have not had to replace anything on it. No tires, which I expect will last me about 4 more years, no need for replacing wipers every year. 2 oil changes per year. I repair of front brakes. That's it.

Your tires are still costing you, because you will have to replace them. Let's say 150 a tire, times 4, divided by 48 months. Equals 12.50 a month.

Oil changes at just lubes, about 45 bucks, times 2, divided by 12. Equals 7.50 a month.

No need to rerplace wipers EVERY year, but 1.25 a month is your cost.

Wash?? Wax?? Windshield washer (important in slushy TO) Park downtown?? Toll roads??

You can see how it all adds up. You might have an easy year, but the AVERAGE is the reality.

And that is why people ride e-bikes!!! Two months of real car costs will get you one!!

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 01:15 PM
Ok so now that we are ignoring the thousands of people who either work or go to the college, the university, hospital, Group Health, doctors building or who park downtown.... go on with your story.

I paid 40 bucks a month while my wife was dying, to park at the hospital, so perhaps I was just being kind to ignore some things.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 01:19 PM
I paid 40 bucks a month while my wife was dying, to park at the hospital, so perhaps I was just being kind to ignore some things.

Ya well ignoring facts is not kind. It's stupid.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 01:35 PM
Ya well ignoring facts is not kind. It's stupid.

Keep trying, child.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 02:34 PM
Keep trying, child.

No problem. Someone has to.

The Chronic Liar
04-19-2016, 03:09 PM
Blueboy is a redneck though.

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 06:21 PM
Yup, sure.

In fact, we're both laughing - at you!!!

If it takes up space on the highway and is any mechanical conveyance, it should be covered. Recall if you will last summer when the E-bike smacked the two parked cars. Legally parked in their driveway. The E-bike rider walked away scott free and the owner had two automobiles to have body work done. Is that fair? Is that equitable? Not a chance. Through no fault of his own the owner is out of pocket what would, at today's inflated world at a couple of thousand dollars. BS!

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 06:25 PM
Bicycles would be banned.

Be realistic, insuring and plating a bicycle would amount to 50 bucks a year, tops. A snow machine is only $150.00 a year.

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 06:29 PM
I do roughly 10K km per yr

The average Canadian drives about 18,000 Km's per annum.

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 06:30 PM
So, when you said 235 a month (we'll ignore parking, as it's not usually a direct cost here), did you add up EVERYTHING??

Are car payments figured in or not?

Anapeg
04-19-2016, 06:34 PM
I think blueboy's usual comment belongs in this thread.

Odd you have to interject this as Blueboy is on average rather liberal with this infamous post.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 06:45 PM
Are car payments figured in or not?

I'd be surprised.

With no payments, my costs were over 400. Of course, I drove more, but no more than the average.

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 06:46 PM
Be realistic, insuring and plating a bicycle would amount to 50 bucks a year, tops. A snow machine is only $150.00 a year.

I wonder. My 250 Honda scooter came in at almost 600 bucks.

Hans
04-19-2016, 06:52 PM
In the survey I asked people to figure out the costs of EVERYTHING, and break it down to a monthly cost. Then the reality of car ownership would show up.

If you get a tuneup every couple of years, dived the cost by 24 months. Wipers once a year, divide by 12. Insurance is easy, as is gas, but include tires (cost about $5 a month), oil changes, brake jobs, windshield washer fluid, car washes, there are all kinds of little things we ignore.

One CAA site said a compact car cost about $9500 a year. That's $791 a month.

Well, if you look at it like that it is a lot more expensive than your quote of $750 per month.

It is almost impossible to calculate it that way because you must include "everything" according to your study.
The only way to do that is after you sold or discarded the vehicle, and add up all costs divided by the amount of months you owned the vehicle.
You would get wildly different figures if you did it like that.

That is why normally they use the vehicle purchase price as a basis to calculate monthly cost, fuel consumption and average service costs.

Hans
04-19-2016, 06:59 PM
Your tires are still costing you, because you will have to replace them. Let's say 150 a tire, times 4, divided by 48 months. Equals 12.50 a month.

Oil changes at just lubes, about 45 bucks, times 2, divided by 12. Equals 7.50 a month.

No need to rerplace wipers EVERY year, but 1.25 a month is your cost.

Wash?? Wax?? Windshield washer (important in slushy TO) Park downtown?? Toll roads??

You can see how it all adds up. You might have an easy year, but the AVERAGE is the reality.

And that is why people ride e-bikes!!! Two months of real car costs will get you one!!


But that is not an average, that is only your number.

I will give you my numbers to show you how different they are:

- Oil change: $120 every 6 months or 5000 miles, whatever comes first.
- Tires: $450 a tire.
- Wipers $1.25.
- Brake pads around $160 yearly
- Rotors around $400, every 2 years

And I am not even counting gas, insurance, initial purchase price, unforeseen costs.

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 07:36 PM
Wash?? Once a year when my wife insists

Wax?? NEVER!

Windshield washer - maybe two gallons a year.
Park downtown?? Negligible

Toll roads?? NEVER
So add $20 per month for a margin of error

I always drive beaters that have a good track record for lo maintenance

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 07:40 PM
The average Canadian drives about 18,000 Km's per annum.

Many who live in Toronto's downtown core don't drive a car at all.
That's what led to the popularity of Zip cars and other similar car sharing companies like car2go

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 11:10 PM
But that is not an average, that is only your number.

I will give you my numbers to show you how different they are:

- Oil change: $120 every 6 months or 5000 miles, whatever comes first.
- Tires: $450 a tire.
- Wipers $1.25.
- Brake pads around $160 yearly
- Rotors around $400, every 2 years

And I am not even counting gas, insurance, initial purchase price, unforeseen costs.

Then I suggest you fight it out with CAA. let us know what happens.

http://www.caa.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/CAA_Driving_Cost_English_2013_web.pdf

Barry Morris
04-19-2016, 11:12 PM
Wash?? Once a year when my wife insists

Wax?? NEVER!

Windshield washer - maybe two gallons a year.
Park downtown?? Negligible

Toll roads?? NEVER
So add $20 per month for a margin of error

I always drive beaters that have a good track record for lo maintenance

And drive it to the Sault at a moments notice???

Bluesky
04-19-2016, 11:52 PM
Sure. No problem. I hope :)

Hans
04-20-2016, 07:08 AM
Then I suggest you fight it out with CAA. let us know what happens.

http://www.caa.ca/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/CAA_Driving_Cost_English_2013_web.pdf

Why? I thought you mentioned before you did your own study, no?

Barry Morris
04-20-2016, 09:38 AM
Why? I thought you mentioned before you did your own study, no?

I did indeed, and two years later I found CAA had the same numbers.

But mine can't be right, because they are mine, is that it?? :) :) :)

Barry Morris
04-20-2016, 09:44 AM
Sure. No problem. I hope :)

A buddy of mine in your line of work, who I'm sure you know, once asked me about buying a year old car. I said, "Look, I know you're making good money (because of his position). Use that to buy the warranty and dependability of a new car. That will let you concentrate on your job, which IS your main concern."

One of my mottoes has always been< "A problem solved by mere money is not really much of a problem."

Bluesky
04-20-2016, 10:20 AM
A buddy of mine in your line of work, who I'm sure you know, once asked me about buying a year old car. I said, "Look, I know you're making good money (because of his position). Use that to buy the warranty and dependability of a new car. That will let you concentrate on your job, which IS your main concern."

One of my mottoes has always been< "A problem solved by mere money is not really much of a problem."


That works if you get a healthy car allowance.
My philosophy has been to stick with beaters that cost me little. I do the research,find the best of essential out there and find one. So far it has worked for me.
My last car was a 2003 Sentra. My current one is a 2001 Altima.
I seem to have fewer problems than guys with brand new car
And I save a ton on car insurance as well. Who Needs Collision when a dent repair costs mire than the car itself?

Hans
04-20-2016, 07:10 PM
I did indeed, and two years later I found CAA had the same numbers.

But mine can't be right, because they are mine, is that it?? :) :) :)

I never said yours had to be incorrect. That is something you incorrectly deduced from my comments.