DEBATE: Is the US the most benign superpower ever?

[Return of Too Many Daves]

Consider this every other superpower through history has invaded countless coutries in efforts to expand their empire. I'm not the biggest fan of American politics, but does the country deserve more credit and less villification, or is it acceptable to hold a modern super power to higher standards?

Just interested to know your thoughts.

[1337]

That is a very archaic way of thinking. Taking over other countries in order to be a superpower, or consider them selves a "Roman Empire".

The world is supposed to be more civilized compared to the way it used to be. The United States had the respect to be a super power by staying in it's own country.

[NewCasa]

The United States has NOT stayed within their borders. They have fought openly in Viet Nam, Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Grenada and I'm sure I've missed someone. In addition to this, the CIA has created endless trouble in South America and Africa. I would say they're still pretty imperialistic, but they're just maybe more subtle about it. I would hardly call the US 'benign'.

[Return of Too Many Daves]

Playing devils advocate but.....

What right have we to expect the US to be anymore civilised than say your colonial ancestors (if you have any)?

Also not sure I understand this line:

"The United States had the respect to be a super power by staying in it's own country. "

I'm not saying countries invade others to become a superpower. If you don't mind me saying you are putting the cart before the horse. Do the US not deserve credit for, in a sense, not making the most of their super powers?

[Return of Too Many Daves]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoCasa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The United States has NOT stayed within their borders. They have fought openly in Viet Nam, Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Grenada and I'm sure I've missed someone. In addition to this, the CIA has created endless trouble in South America and Africa. I would say they're still pretty imperialistic, but they're just maybe more subtle about it. I would hardly call the US 'benign'. </div></div>

But compared to previous super powers:

Russia, Germany, England, Austo-hungary, France, Spain, Rome, Mesopotamia, Rome, et. etc. have they not been more restrained?

TMD, it might be interesting if you posted hard historical facts.
List the Superpower, list the countries that were invaded.

Otherwise it becomes a real mishmash of an apples and oranges comparison.

For instance, can you compare an outright invasion followed by permanent occupation by the invading power with a war designed only to topple a current regime to allow other political forces to come to the fore? One is a blatant imperialism, whereas the other is.. what?

[Return of Too Many Daves]

Forced regime change and globalisation?

One is forcing their absolute will on their occupied territories and exploiting them to the full.

The other is just forcing their ideology on their occupied territories.

I must admit I'm not sure what I think about this one, I am just concerned that sometimes the US is judged too harshly.

I totally agree with you on that score.

[GenX]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Quote:</div><div class="ubbcode-body">One is forcing their absolute will on their occupied territories and exploiting them to the full.

The other is just forcing their ideology on their occupied territories. </div></div>

Yes, and let's remember that particular ideology is not an 'American value', or 'Canadian value', but rather a conglomeration of western values. Most areas of the world do not need this imposition of values; but the failed societies of the world need at the very least something that resembles western values, which at the end of the day are simply basic human values: respect for the individual created as a free individual.

Critics of the U.S. and West say those values are particularistic values to only a few countries. That, of course, is wrong. Valuing human freedom and the primacy of the individual over government is a basic human value. The West embraced this fundamental human value, while some societies today have not. Those societies are our current failed societies; and failed societies produce terrorism, among other things.

Out of Islam’s over 1 billion adherents, only a small percentage (10, most experts say) actually subscribe to the radicalized views of Whabism, as promoted by bin Laden and others like him. Nevertheless, 100 million people subscribing to such views is a great danger. These people are holding on to views that should have been extinguished in the 14th Century. There is no place for radical Islam in today’s world. Radical Islam cannot tolerate other views and religions. Put simply, it cannot exist in today's world. Also, it is no mere coincidence radical Islam is embraced largely in poor and failed societies of Asia.

The U.S. exports basic human values. It has not entered a country militarily and stayed indefinitely. What other former world power can say as much?

The U.S. paid (The Marshall Plan) to rebuild a former enemy it defeated. No other country in history has done that. That shows the U,.S. is indeed the most benign superpower in history.

[Soundbear]

The United States exports basic human values to countries that work for the benefit of the United States.

[NewCasa]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Return of Too Many Daves</div><div class="ubbcode-body"><div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: NoCasa</div><div class="ubbcode-body">The United States has NOT stayed within their borders. They have fought openly in Viet Nam, Korea, Afghanistan, Iraq, Grenada and I'm sure I've missed someone. In addition to this, the CIA has created endless trouble in South America and Africa. I would say they're still pretty imperialistic, but they're just maybe more subtle about it. I would hardly call the US 'benign'. </div></div>

But compared to previous super powers:

Russia, Germany, England, Austo-hungary, France, Spain, Rome, Mesopotamia, Rome, et. etc. have they not been more restrained? </div></div>

Restrained is one word. I think I'd rather use 'subtle'.

[Hans]

Every super power/empire in history has ended at some point in time.

[GenX]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hans</div><div class="ubbcode-body">Every super power/empire in history has ended at some point in time. </div></div>


Ladies and Gentlemen, Dr. Obvious has entered the house...

[Return of Too Many Daves]

LOL I know, except the US hasn't. So he might as well say "apart from everything that hasn't ended, everything has come to an end some time". LOL

[Hans]

You mean the US has not yet. The Roman empire lasted for a long time also, but eventually they went down the drain...

[GenX]

<div class="ubbcode-block"><div class="ubbcode-header">Originally Posted By: Hans</div><div class="ubbcode-body">You mean the US has not yet. The Roman empire lasted for a long time also, but eventually they went down the drain...
</div></div>

Ladies and Gentlemen, Dr. Obvious remains in the house...