Satan and sin

[Upper Decker]

Ive been thinking about this particular question as of recent and I cant seem to come up with a proper reasoning behind it. If you guys would be nice and correct me where im wrong to get a better understanding of the question.

Satan was cast out of heaven for being a rebel, and was condemned to hell after losing the biblical war of angels. From that point on Satan was there to poison man into sinning and people would go to hell to be punished eternally for not repenting thier sins. Hopefully im right so far, or at least on the right track.

Now, if Satan is the sworn enemy of god and wants man to follow his will - why would hell be a punishment at the hands of satan? You are doing satans work, why would he torture you for all eternity?

I dont understand why one entity would reward you for following thier will and way of doing things, while another punishes you. I could understand it if god ordered the devil and demons to carry, but im to understand that just isnt it - the devil wouldnt answer to god as they are enemies.

Maybe I can get some clarification on this?

[stupefied]

Mixing logic and religion, lol.

[riggs]

Mixing logic and religion, lol.

Would that be like oil and water?

[Anapeg]

Mixing logic and religion, lol.

Now there is a round peg into a square hole!

Upper Decker, it equates with yin and yang, good and bad. If you behave as I tell you you get this BUT if you do against what I say you get this horrid thing. It is the grown up version of the Boogy man. A tool to keep the masses in line, make them "toe the mark" as it were. Just my opinion on the matter.

[Upper Decker]

Doesnt that seem a little tyrannical , even a little bit immature of an entity thats supposed to be ominipitant? This is a theme across the board on almost all religions too, I just used the christian example as im not well versed in others. So the gist of it is fear tactics and nothing more?

[Blunt]

Now, if Satan is the sworn enemy of god and wants man to follow his will - why would hell be a punishment at the hands of satan? You are doing satans work, why would he torture you for all eternity?

I dont understand why one entity would reward you for following thier will and way of doing things, while another punishes you. I could understand it if god ordered the devil and demons to carry, but im to understand that just isnt it - the devil wouldnt answer to god as they are enemies.

Maybe I can get some clarification on this?

I'll sum up what I believe would be the Christian argument. God wants you to come chill for eternity in eternal happiness. Since Satan dislikes God, he wants to do the opposite of God's will, as a slap in God's face. Thus, when Satan gets your soul, he makes you all sad and tortured forever, just the opposite of what God would do.

It's a silly explanation, it relies on the idea that God cares about you, which is an idea that no Christian can even remotely support before it's ripped apart.

[hobo]

You probably don't want chapter and verse answers but for a Christian it is wise to know a little about the devil and his helpers.

http://www.dianedew.com/satan.htm

[Anapeg]

You bring up omnipotence and immaturity. What of the omnipotent being that creates the human race and all life forms below them for support just so the humans can worship Him? Is this not the crux of Christian teaching? As for the "all religions" being similar theme, if you, say two thousand or more years ago heard of some ruler from away having success at containing the peons with religion do you not think you would jump on the band wagon and follow suit? Now you have a much smaller army to control the masses God will take care of a slew of them for you and YOU get to say what God says is right and wrong. Handy as hell don't you think?

[RWGR]

Now, if Satan is the sworn enemy of god and wants man to follow his will - why would hell be a punishment at the hands of satan? You are doing satans work, why would he torture you for all eternity?

Satan isn't torturing you. The torture, the most agonizing man can experience, is the moment the soul realizes it is forever separated from God, for all eternity. The soul (we are all souls, inside physical bodies) will wail in anguish for all eternity.

That is Hell: eternal separation from God. Satan doesn't have to do a thing to you. All your pain and grief will come from within.

the devil wouldnt answer to god as they are enemies.

Every knee of creation, both of this temporal physical world, and of the permanent spiritual world, falls at the name of Jesus. Satan and God are enemies; but that doesn't mean they are equals. Not even close.

Lucifer was one of God's most beautiful angels. He was granted gifts above most angels. Of those gifts, amazing intelligence and the ability to perform wondrous tasks are a part. And so it continues today.

But the creature (Lucifer) is never greater than the Creator.

[RWGR]

I'll sum up what I believe would be the Christian argument. God wants you to come chill for eternity in eternal happiness. Since Satan dislikes God, he wants to do the opposite of God's will, as a slap in God's face. Thus, when Satan gets your soul, he makes you all sad and tortured forever, just the opposite of what God would do.

It's a silly explanation

It certainly is; and one that is amazingly un-biblical and un-theological.

[Anapeg]

It certainly is; and one that is amazingly un-biblical and un-theological.

Would virtually any answer by a non believer be un-biblical as well as un-theological by definition?

[RWGR]

Would virtually any answer by a non believer be un-biblical as well as un-theological by definition?

No. Some unbelievers still choose to study theology, and maybe the Bible. But most don't; and that is why such ridiculous comments as Blunt's exist.

[Bluesky]

Now, if Satan is the sworn enemy of god and wants man to follow his will - why would hell be a punishment at the hands of satan? You are doing satans work, why would he torture you for all eternity?

Maybe I can get some clarification on this?

Your (mistaken) assumption is that those in hell are suffering at the hands of Satan.
I do not know where that assumption originated.
It certainly doesn't come from the Bible.
Satan himself will experience suffering for eternity, probably the most of all of hell's inhabitants.

[Upper Decker]

From the link hobo posted...

A. Satan is a created being.

Ezekiel 28:13, 15
1. He was created perfect and beautiful. Ezekiel 28:15, 17

Why would god essentially create himself (god is perfect, and there are no other occurances of pefection mentioned aside from god and satan)? Then rebel against himself, then condem himself. And can you explain why lucifer will never be greater than god, perfection is perfection no matter how you slice it.

1. To hinder the work and the Word of God.
Daniel 10:12, 13; Mark 4:15; 1 Thessalonians 2:18
Thats the main part of my argument : why would someone punish you for doing thier work and going against the enemy? Doesnt make a lick of sense.

[Upper Decker]

Your (mistaken) assumption is that those in hell are suffering at the hands of Satan.
I do not know where that assumption originated.
It certainly doesn't come from the Bible.
Satan himself will experience suffering for eternity, probably the most of all of hell's inhabitants.

I didnt mean satan directly, but satan in general as the one in charge of hell no? And if he is the one suffering more than others, why sway man to his ways. Misery loves company?

[RWGR]

Why would god essentially create himself (god is perfect, and there are no other occurances of pefection mentioned aside from god and satan)?

A perfect creation is still not as great as the Creator. It's relative. One is still subservient, in all aspects, to what created it.

And can you explain why lucifer will never be greater than god, perfection is perfection no matter how you slice it.

The created cannot be as "great" as something that did not need to be created. God has always existed. Satan had to be created.

It's like asking why can't a slice of cheese be greater than the cow that provided the necessary ingredient. The cheese doesn't exist without the cow, so the cheese can never be greater.

why would someone punish you for doing thier work and going against the enemy? Doesnt make a lick of sense.

You're not reading the answers. It is not Satan doing the damage down in Hell. It is self-imposed. Those in Hell will need no outside help in their agony; it will all be self-imposed.

Satan will just happen to be there, too. His rebellion began long ago, and still is not over. But someday it will end, and he will be in eternal agony along with all other souls in Hell.

[RWGR]

I didnt mean satan directly, but satan in general as the one in charge of hell no? And if he is the one suffering more than others, why sway man to his ways. Misery loves company?

If you hate God, would you want what God wants?

God desires all souls come home to Heaven. Why wouldn't Satan work for the opposite?

[Upper Decker]

So to sum it up :

Satan is doing gods work by swaying man to hell for eternity. Which would mean they are in a partnership of sorts? And once again im back to the conclusion that none of this makes sense. Because if you have the ability to create perfection on a whim, then why not just eliminate everything that isnt perfect and live in eternity with that?

[Anapeg]

Free choice come in right about here I think?

[Upper Decker]

Which really brings me back the original question lol. This seems to be a vicious circle.

Were told we have free will and choice, but have to follow commands and if we dont we are condemned to eternal torture and suffering.